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-   -   STAG Model 1 or Model 2? (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f20/stag-model-1-model-2-a-57762/)

BTenn 02-15-2012 04:11 AM

STAG Model 1 or Model 2?
 
I think I have decided to get the model 2 bc of the flip up and down iron sights... Would you back my decision or choose differently? Why?

mjkeat 02-15-2012 04:26 AM

For the money you can ditch the commercial grade non mil-spec AR for something much better from a more consistent company. Colt 6920, BCM, Spikes, PSA, LMT...

EiteCombat 02-15-2012 11:22 AM

Why does everyone try to talk people out of Stag on this forum? I've read great things everywhere else. Does a 4150 steel 1:9 chrome lined barrel and a 11595E Certified 1:7 barrel make that much of a difference for a regular person? Thats the only difference.

billt 02-15-2012 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EiteCombat (Post 709236)
Does a 4150 steel 1:9 chrome lined barrel and a 11595E Certified 1:7 barrel make that much of a difference for a regular person? Thats the only difference.

Not at all. The fact is a 1 in 9" twist barrel is far more useful to the average shooter, which is why so many AR-15 manufacturers use them. The only reason the military specifies a 1 in 7" twist is because of the much longer tracer round projectiles they fire.

In fact if you take a look at the new Hornady 8th Edition Reloading Manual, all of the loading data they have published for the .223 / 5.56 MM Service Rifle was obtained using a Colt AR-15 with a 1 in 9" twist Citadel barrel. This data includes bullet weights up to, and including their 80 grain A-Max bullet. Hornady could have easily used a 1 in 7" twist barrel for achieving their data if they thought it would have provided more accuracy. They did not.

purehavoc 02-15-2012 12:38 PM

I have 2 1:7 barrels one shoots 55 gr fine the other not so much , I have had to switch over to 62 gr to get the accuracy I was looking for and you dont find 62 gr on every shelf of your local shops its mostly 55 gr and under varmit loads . I have a 1:12 savage and I couldnt ask for a better gun with 55 gr bullets .5" moa @ 100 . If I had to do it again with limited access to 62 gr I would have went 1:9 just for that reason . I dont own one but Stag is a fine rifle and I believe they offer a lifetime guarantee on their barrels now . There are cheaper rifles out there and higher priced rifles out there , but if thats what you want dont second guess yourself or let anyone talk you out of it .

mjkeat 02-15-2012 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EiteCombat (Post 709236)
Why does everyone try to talk people out of Stag on this forum? I've read great things everywhere else. Does a 4150 steel 1:9 chrome lined barrel and a 11595E Certified 1:7 barrel make that much of a difference for a regular person? Thats the only difference.

There's more to it than the barrel. Look at some forums where the guys use their firearms more often and in more demanding situations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by billt (Post 709272)
Not at all. The fact is a 1 in 9" twist barrel is far more useful to the average shooter, which is why so many AR-15 manufacturers use them. The only reason the military specifies a 1 in 7" twist is because of the much longer tracer round projectiles they fire.

In fact if you take a look at the new Hornady 8th Edition Reloading Manual, all of the loading data they have published for the .223 / 5.56 MM Service Rifle was obtained using a Colt AR-15 with a 1 in 9" twist Citadel barrel. This data includes bullet weights up to, and including their 80 grain A-Max bullet. Hornady could have easily used a 1 in 7" twist barrel for achieving their data if they thought it would have provided more accuracy. They did not.

Who puts 1:9 barrels on their ARs, the low end manufacturers. Coincidence, I'm betting against it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by purehavoc (Post 709274)
I have 2 1:7 barrels one shoots 55 gr fine the other not so much , I have had to switch over to 62 gr to get the accuracy I was looking for and you dont find 62 gr on every shelf of your local shops its mostly 55 gr and under varmit loads . I have a 1:12 savage and I couldnt ask for a better gun with 55 gr bullets .5" moa @ 100 . If I had to do it again with limited access to 62 gr I would have went 1:9 just for that reason . I dont own one but Stag is a fine rifle and I believe they offer a lifetime guarantee on their barrels now . There are cheaper rifles out there and higher priced rifles out there , but if thats what you want dont second guess yourself or let anyone talk you out of it .

Not saying Stag is horrible but, there are better choices for the money and you won't have to pay extra for standard features.

EiteCombat 02-15-2012 03:06 PM

Colt puts 1:9 barrels in some of their guns. I didn't realize they were low end.

http://www.colt.com/ColtLawEnforcement/Products/ColtTacticalCarbine.aspx

Sniper03 02-15-2012 03:16 PM

Only a thought!
All of this Mil-Spec stuff is a lot hoopla! And used as a sales gimmick in the commercial market. It is a Military adopted standard as those of us in the weapons industry have complied to as a base standard. But in reality a lot of the quality gun manufacturers hold tighter specs than those that are required in the Mil Spec Standard specifications. And I must say there are a few that do lend to be *less than Mil-Spec Standards. But for most of us who cares if the barrel is coated under the front sight housing and on the feed ramps. Sabre for example when they were in business being Mil-Spec polished the Feed Ramps on their rifle barrels before coating. While Rock River and others polish after the coating process which would not be acceptable by Mil-Spec standard. There are alot of great rifles out there to choose from. Like Rock River Arms, Stag, Daniels Defense, Les Baer. And yes some of my other favorites are LMT who builds a fine piece also. The modern Colts?? I have heard that Spikes also builds a good weapon. So moral of the story do not get hung up "totally" on the Mil-Spec issue. It does not always mean you are getting the best weapon or the best quality weapon you can buy. And I would suggest going with the 1:9 :)

03

jgand72 02-15-2012 03:21 PM

I bought a Stag Model 2 last May, and I have had nothing but good things to say about it. Accurate, and not a single problem yet.

purehavoc 02-15-2012 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjkeat (Post 709366)
There's more to it than the barrel. Look at some forums where the guys use their firearms more often and in more demanding situations.



Who puts 1:9 barrels on their ARs, the low end manufacturers. Coincidence, I'm betting against it.

So let me get this straight because it has more than 1:7 twist is a low end manufacturer ?
I would gladly put my 1:12 barrel to your 1:7 twist at 500 yards and we will see who shoots the tightest groups . Twist is nothing more than how fast it spins the bullet , tighter twists are made for better accuracy in heavier bullets like a 75 gr , just like a 1:12 spins a 45-55 gr varmit round real nice , Barrel quality is not measured by barrel twist so lets get things straight , a 1:9 twist will damn near shoot anything you put down the barrel . cram a 45 gr varmit round down your 1:7 barrel and let me know if you can hit anything ? You wont, it will spin the bullet apart before it ever reachs 20 yards. Most high end target rifles are using a 1:8-1:12 twist in .223 so you cannot say that anything more than 1:7 is substandard on quality in any rifle . 1:7 twist is Mil Spec , whooppeeee, whats that mean ? Nothing , Thats just what the military uses to meet their specs in a gun they order , does that mean its better quality or better shooting than a 1:8 or 1:9 . NO!!! thats just the standard they use .


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