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-   -   rock river vs. S&W M&P (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f20/rock-river-vs-s-w-m-p-3544/)

shoez 03-03-2008 01:51 AM

rock river vs. S&W M&P
 
Hello all,

I am new to the AR world, as alot of posts here seem to say. I have been looking for awhile and am now looking seriously. I saw a Rock River Predator Pursuit today at a gun show and it was sweet. 20" stainless heavy Wilson barrel, round forearm, in the flat top configuration. Nice trigger too. But the guy didn't take trades so, not having $1000 handy, I left. Went to a gun shop that is a dealer for RRA, and he also had a good deal on Smith and Wesson M&P's, flattop, 16" barrel, and a collapsable stock. I could get for $799 after rebate. Not bad.

Now, here is my problem. I really like the RRA. But pricey. S&W ok. Don't really like the skinny barrel and collapsable stock. My requirements are good accuracy and reliability. I am NOT going to accessorize this thing like I am going to combat. I handload and intend to taylor a load to the gun. I am going to use this gun for strictly target shooting, have a big scope on it, and the RRA has a 3/4" MOA guarantee. But the guy swore to me the S&W would shoot just as good. And could I swap out the collapsable stock for a fixed one? So, who has experience with the S&W? Some opinions would be greatly appreciated.

scoutman 03-03-2008 05:28 PM

Apples and Oranges. RRA is a 20" 1/8 twist with no sights and a fixed stock guaranteed to shoot sub MOA groups at 100M. S&W is a 16" 1/9 twist with 6 position collapsable stock, Troy Industries BUIS on "A" models, and will shoot sub MOA groups at 100M and 200M after 3k rounds downrange.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/longgun_reviews/swmp15_121906/index.html

If you plan on punching paper at 100M-300M, then either rifle will be more than accurate with the appropriate ammunition. If you plan on moving out to 600M, then you won't be satisfied with a 16" tube. I would buy the M&P, sell the Troy sights if you don't want them ($125), sell the 6 position stock ($75), replace with a fixed unit, then take the $200 I saved and have nice start to a new target scope. All in what you want the rifle to do though.

shoez 03-03-2008 09:49 PM

The M&P I am looking at has no sights at all, I think they call it "optic ready". But, from the sound of it, the stock can be replaced with a fixed one? And yes, all this rifle will ever do is punch paper at 100 and 200 yards. I dream of a prarie dog hunt someday, but that is just a dream right now. Guess I could find some coyotes or ground hogs around here in Illinois. But paper and maybe a tin can will be the primary target. I am starting to lean to the Smith, kind of because it is a lot easier to obtain and it seems like it will do what I want. But, we will see.

scoutman 03-03-2008 10:45 PM

Yes, you can switch stocks easily. Without sights, it brings the two a little closer in price range. The beauty of the AR platform, is that if for some reason you find that the M&P no longer fits the bill in it's current configuration(long range, big game hunting, etc) you just drop in a new complete upper and have a new rifle. I have two lowers, but 4 complete uppers. 5.56, 7.62, 6.8, and the new .260 Remington. All have dedicated optics, so just pull two pins, drop in the new upper, start shooting. Just that simple. For that matter, you could buy a complete RRA Predator upper somewhere down the road and have both.

JWIII 08-03-2008 10:31 PM

I have a S&W, and I love it... over 1000rds with zero problems so far.

RMTactical 08-03-2008 11:23 PM

I would prefer an AR15 made by Smith & Wesson.

RL357Mag 08-04-2008 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoez (Post 18016)
Hello all,

I am new to the AR world, as alot of posts here seem to say. I have been looking for awhile and am now looking seriously. I saw a Rock River Predator Pursuit today at a gun show and it was sweet. 20" stainless heavy Wilson barrel, round forearm, in the flat top configuration. Nice trigger too. But the guy didn't take trades so, not having $1000 handy, I left. Went to a gun shop that is a dealer for RRA, and he also had a good deal on Smith and Wesson M&P's, flattop, 16" barrel, and a collapsable stock. I could get for $799 after rebate. Not bad.

Now, here is my problem. I really like the RRA. But pricey. S&W ok. Don't really like the skinny barrel and collapsable stock. My requirements are good accuracy and reliability. I am NOT going to accessorize this thing like I am going to combat. I handload and intend to taylor a load to the gun. I am going to use this gun for strictly target shooting, have a big scope on it, and the RRA has a 3/4" MOA guarantee. But the guy swore to me the S&W would shoot just as good. And could I swap out the collapsable stock for a fixed one? So, who has experience with the S&W? Some opinions would be greatly appreciated.


The Predator Pursuit lists for $1075 in the RRA retail catalog. I bought the NMA4 which lists for $1215. But I paid $915...how? If you are friends with an FFL holder, ask him to give you a signed copy of his FFL and order the gun directly from RRA. It will ship to his address, but you will get dealer pricing! You will pay less for the RRA than for the S&W also. RRA's dealer pricing is $300 less than their retail pricing. Incidentally, with my handloads I knocked the 3/4 moa guarantee down to less than 1/2". They are VERY accurate and you would need a machine rest to measure their true potential. The .223 Wylde Chambering is more accurate than the standard 5.56 chambering. Additionally, RRA sells complete uppers from 9mm up to .458 Socom if you ever want to convert your AR in another caliber!

G21.45 08-04-2008 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RMTactical (Post 34728)
I would prefer an AR15 made by Smith & Wesson.

:eek: Hey! What, the heck, are you doing over here?

I'm used to talking to you at GT! (And you're using the same screen name, too!) I was going to disagree with you - Especially since the receivers are made by the same company - but, I recognize you usually know what you're talking about. So, go ahead and tell me, 'Why' do you prefer the AR assemblage that's presently being marketed by S&W?

JWIII 08-04-2008 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G21.45 (Post 34740)
:eek: Hey! What, the heck, are you doing over here?

I'm used to talking to you at GT! (And you're using the same screen name, too!) I was going to disagree with you - Especially since the receivers are made by the same company - but, I recognize you usually know what you're talking about. So, go ahead and tell me, 'Why' do you prefer the AR assemblage that's presently being marketed by S&W?

I know the S&W's are made by CMT, but I heard that was the earlier models. Now S&W makes their own rifle??? Is That true?

JWIII 08-14-2008 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWIII (Post 34770)
I know the S&W's are made by CMT, but I heard that was the earlier models. Now S&W makes their own rifle??? Is That true?


Update... I talked to S&W, they have no plans to make their own parts. They are still using CMT.

S&W = Stag


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