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New 458 Socom build...


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Old 05-19-2017, 12:20 AM   #1
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Default New 458 Socom build...

Ok as some of you know I've been lusting after a 458 Socom for a while now. Sniper03 and JonM turned me on to this incredible caliber while I was looking at the 45 Raptor. Here's the thread on that discussion if anyone is interested;
http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f25/big-bore-ar10-114329/

After much though and debate I'm building now. Finally decided that this deserves its own build thread as I'm going to build both upper and lower. The 458 needs some mods that make it different from a normal AR15, hence the thread.

Design:
I've decided on a light weight AR with a 16" barrel, free float handguards and flat top upper. Some parts have already been ordered, I'll link those in below. The gun is going to be used as a hog gun, with an emphasis on one shot take down power.

Ammo;
I'm also setting up to reload the ammo as this round has a hefty price tag. Dies, brass and an initial selection of bullets have been acquired about two months ago. I've also ordered two LEE lead molds, from Midway, for a 340 grain flat nose, and a 405 grain flat nose. Also got the factory crimp die for the round as its not in the basic 458 Socom die set. 100 rds of new brass, as I need somewhere to start...
File Type: jpg 528.jpg (51.7 KB, 41 views)
File Type: jpg 529.jpg (43.9 KB, 41 views)
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-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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Old 05-19-2017, 12:34 AM   #2
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Ok I ordered the upper, an Aero Precision COP kit in black, with the mid length integrated handguard. Good deal on this thing, I posted it to Deals,deals,deals a while back when I first ordered the part.

https://aeroprecisionusa.com/cop-m4-mid-length-upper-receiver-minimalist-black.html?sc_src=email_1522152&sc_lid=102016639&s c_uid=67Ku957kgq&sc_llid=18959&utm_source=Emarsys& utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily+Deal+-+Spring+Sale+2017+-+AR15+Flip+Up+Sights+4.27.172017-04-27+18%3A16%3A00&sc_eh=9b11de4500a25dfc1

New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion

Paid $299.99 with free shipping for it. I knew I was going to need to enlarge the ejection port, blend the feed ramp. But I thought seriously strong, one piece upper for mega caliber build, right? I like the way that a mid length handguard covers a carbine length gas system too.

Here's the drawing of what I need to do to the ejection port to clear that big fat cartridge easily;458 Socom ejection port.jpg
Notice that the cover door still works and covers the opening. Also see the note about cutting the lower portion first, then working the upper side to finish dimensions.

Here's the feed ramp blend that Tromix recommends. Top is a standard unblended m4 feed ramp. Bottom is a blend into the big bore barrel extension. I'll be doing this to improve the feeding with large flat nose bullets.
File Type: jpg SocomXRampA_zps91cfefbc.jpg (33.9 KB, 39 views)
File Type: png 03be0a196873354959b7a660276b01d5.png (167.3 KB, 37 views)
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-- Rush Limbaugh, in a moment of unaccustomed profundity

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

"MOLON LABE" - Come and get them, can't be any plainer than that!

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Old 05-19-2017, 12:44 AM   #3
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looking forward to your build! awesome round.

i have shot an AR in 458 socom. wow! i liked it! i don't really need one, but i may need to do one simply because i want one. if i did build one, it would be super basic and simple though.

subscribed to this thread.

good luck Mr. DW. this might be the inspiration i need to get started!
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Old 05-19-2017, 12:56 AM   #4
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Next I've gotten a handful of small parts from JSE.
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
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"You know why there's a Second Amendment? In case the government fails to follow the first one."
-- Rush Limbaugh, in a moment of unaccustomed profundity

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

"MOLON LABE" - Come and get them, can't be any plainer than that!

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Old 05-19-2017, 01:01 AM   #5
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Next I've gotten a handful of small parts from JSE.
New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion
  • This Bolt Carrier Assembly has been precision machined from 8620 high-carbon steel to Semi Auto specifications and coated by Nickel Boron finish providing high-lubricity, a harder-than-chrome surface, and extreme corrosion resistance.
  • This is an assembled carrier with properly staked gas-key. It does not include bolt assembly, firing pin, cam pin, or firing pin retaining pin.

The barrel I'm ordering has a bolt face included for 458 Socom so that carrier, a cam pin, firing pin and firing pin retainer finish off the bolt group. Nickle Boron you ask, why? Largely because its cool and the price was right. I also ordered a steel 0.750 gas block and a carbine length gas tube with pin. I'm thinking along the lines of an Adams Arms low profile piston kit, but my finances won't stretch that far just now...

Going with the Lightweight 16.5" barrel from tromix,
  • SCM01-LW
  • Lightweight profile .850/.750/.730 1:14 twist Barrel/Bolt Combo $324

http://www.tromix.com/458-socom-parts-1.html

Price is right, and they are one of the originators of 458 Socom. They have it all worked out already. Nice people and they took the time to answer my questions quickly and thoroughly
. Barrel is carbine length gas, 0.750 at the block, threaded 5/8-24 and almost 6oz lighter than their other barrels. Nice.
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"You know why there's a Second Amendment? In case the government fails to follow the first one."
-- Rush Limbaugh, in a moment of unaccustomed profundity

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

"MOLON LABE" - Come and get them, can't be any plainer than that!

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Old 05-19-2017, 08:54 AM   #6
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Looking forward to watching the progress.

I wanted a 458 SOCUM. Still didn't I think, but I went with the 450 Bushmaster instead. Why? Mostly because Ruger came out with the Anerican Ranch Rifle in 450 Bushmaster and I like the rifle. A secondary reason is that it's much cheaper to shoot, even for a reoader!

The reason for my build is much like yours. Feral hog hunting. I hunt with dogs and like the 5.56 with a TSX bullet, or the 25x45 Sharps with the TSX bullet. They kill hogs very well with a point blank shot into there boiler room. DRT. The 45-70 works , but not as fast. I'm curious how the 450 Bushmaster and 458 SOCOM will do as well. One of my catch dogs is no longer with us and I'm not thinking of replacing him, so I will not be trying to bring hogs back alive anymore. Plus I just like the bigger bullet and I will be shooting at range, not with the muzzle practically against the hog.

I have both of the Lee molds you have. They drop right at .457. they are the only Lee moulds I have that do that. Most drop a few thousands over what is specified. Of course all 3 of my 45/70 like .459 cast bullets. . I use the Lee .459 hollow base 405 grain bullet, but usually hunt with the Speer 400 grain flat point.

Why doing on the 45/70? Because the 45/70 and the 458 SOCOM share common bullets and is the 45/70 for the AR platform as far as I an concerned. The 450 Bushmaster uses pistol bullets. Wish Ruger would have brought out the 458 SOCOM instead!
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Old 05-19-2017, 02:23 PM   #7
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Greg you just pretty much summed up the reasoning behind the 458 socom vs the 45 raptor that I was originally looking at. Take a look at the older thread that I linked in the first post. It all comes down to pistol bullets vs rifle bullets. Especially take a look at Sniper03's buffalo he killed with the 458 socom. That illustrates why you really need a rifle bullet! Its all down to bullet design.

I shoot hog quite a bit. I've got a buddy with a row of stitches all the way from wrist to elbow from a 223 rd that didn't get the job done. Read the story at the end of the older thread. Got me on the bigger is better bandwagon, at least for hogs and other dangerous game. My first upgrade was 6.8 spc2, great gun and a super hog killer. The second build was a 7" barreled 300 blackout AR pistol. Nice close support firepower. I've been thinking mega caliber AR's for some time. That's 450 bushmaster, 458 socom and 50 beowulf. There are a few others but they are Wildcats and none offer much improvement over those three.

450 bushmaster didn't make the cut because of the pistol bullet thing, its 0.451 not 0.458. 50 beowulf, just not many choices in a 50 cal bullet. Its also largely a proprietary cartridge still. Bill Alexander of Alexander Arms doesn't want to share his baby. That leaves 458 socom as the clear winner. Its not perfect, the rebated rim and a stepped shoulder cartridge design are negatives in my book, but it has a true .458 bullet diameter. This allows use of all the really great, and proven 45/70 and 458 winchester rifle bullets. Lots of selection, and the bullets are all proven for their purpose. The new round is also almost identical ballistically to the old 45/70, a proven buffalo rifle. That's the key in my view.
File Type: jpg 458SSizeMatters.jpg (53.2 KB, 36 views)
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-- Rush Limbaugh, in a moment of unaccustomed profundity

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

"MOLON LABE" - Come and get them, can't be any plainer than that!

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Old 05-19-2017, 03:25 PM   #8
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DW

I am excited about your build! Can't wait to see it and get a Range Report. But when it comes to pigs! I refer to the 458 SOCOM as the HAMMER!
I had the pleasure of shooting a 458 SOCOM in Full Auto in November. I could not believe how controllable it was. Literally a pleasure to shoot!!
It also has become one of my closet gun for home self defense should the Zombies show up day or night. I have some 325 gr. Polymer Tipped Bullets from TGD for it. Living in the mountains you have to be your own Defense Force for at least 15-20 minutes! Of course you can always count on the neighbors to be a flanking force should the Zombies come!
Regarding reloading a friend of mine who was just featured in one of the Shooting Magazines for his company loading the most accurate 458 SOCOM ammunition tested in the test. TGD Ammunition Company of Colona Illinois. But he advised me that if the Reloader has problems with seating the bullets regarding crushing the casings with the 458 SOCOM Seating Die. He suggests using a 45 cal. Long Colt or 45 Auto Pistol Expander Die to open up the case mouth slightly before using the regular seating die from the 458 SOCOM Set.
Keep us informed and the parts look Great as well!

03
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Old 05-19-2017, 03:48 PM   #9
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Thats good info Sniper03. I haven't' started to load up my cases yet. If I run into problems with the seating I'll try the pistol die trick.

I've got some of the Hornady 325 grain FTX poly tips, they were one of the most recommended bullets for the caliber. Also supposed to be very easy feeding because of the tip shape. Those 300 grain Hornady hollow points were the #2 on that same list. Speer Deep Curl's are on my list to try. Along with the two cast bullets that I got the LEE molds for. Those two are more of a lower cost practice ammo alternative than a hunting round. But I will be running some penetration tests with the lead bullets. I've been pleasantly surprised by cast bullets before. Especially big, heavy lead chunks at moderate velocities. My 300 Blackout, cast lead 230's were an eye opener...

New 458 Socom build... - AR-15 Discussion

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/558791/barnes-triple-shock-x-tsx-bullets-458-caliber-458-diameter-350-grain-hollow-point-flat-base-lead-free-box-of-20

I'd love to try some of these TSX bullets but at $20+ a box of 20 they are out of my budget for the near future. $1.09 a bullet for components seems a bit excessive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallas53 View Post
looking forward to your build! awesome round.

i have shot an AR in 458 socom. wow! i liked it! i don't really need one, but i may need to do one simply because i want one. if i did build one, it would be super basic and simple though.

subscribed to this thread.

good luck Mr. DW. this might be the inspiration i need to get started!
Dallas, its not about need. I've already got guns to handle pretty much any conceivable hunting situation in the 6.8 SPC and 300 Blackout. Its that I've wanted one.
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-- Rush Limbaugh, in a moment of unaccustomed profundity

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1 Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

"MOLON LABE" - Come and get them, can't be any plainer than that!

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Old 05-19-2017, 03:58 PM   #10
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DW
Please go back and read my "correction" made regarding the 45 LC AND 45 AUTO Expander Die.

03
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