Looking for advice on what M-4 to buy - Page 3
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:32 AM   #21
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I needed a place to put it. I don't shoot it through there. The rear sight hangs there. if I run out of battery, I move it to the top rail.
Like Scott I thought it was there incase you decided to go full on Gansta and shoot it at 90. They make Glock sights like that incase your looking.

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:42 AM   #22
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They make Glock sights like that incase your looking.
Well I guess there is a market... its mostly an illegal one but a market nontheless.

We're all goin' to hell and I'm drivin' the bus.
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Old 12-07-2011, 04:31 PM   #23
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I bought mine as a kid and assembled at home. Cost me $670 + $25 for the FFL transfer of the Lower. Love the product, hate the company; Del-Ton. (google; won't justify that place with a link). Their customer service was non-existent for me; cost me a lot of frustration AND money for their mistake; refused to correct it. The product, however, is fine. Love the rifle. No issues, ever in the last three years of ownership. Buying a 'kit' might be an option for you; I used Youtube "how to assemble" videos to ensure I got it right - had been 15 years since I'd been to the Armorer's course.
What was your problem with Del Ton that they refused to fix?
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Old 12-09-2011, 12:16 PM   #24
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Have you ever tried a thumb over grip?
I don't know what that is.

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I thought it was there for when you want to go gangsta on somebody.
I am from the west-coast...and did learn to shoot by resting the weapon hanging out a car window...playa!

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What was your problem with Del Ton that they refused to fix?
Billing issues - don't want to derail this thread; but since you asked. If you have specific questions, PM and I'll answer - or maybe we take it to another thread?

From about a week after my order shipped, as posted to another forum:

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I just got off the phone with Del-ton. I'm out of luck - I'm posting this as a warning to others.


I placed my order 15 November with credit-card "A". Nothing charged to my card for months. in the mean time Card A raised my rate by about 5%. PRIOR to my order shipping, I went on to the website's option for "Change existing order" and I changed my payment method to Credit-card "B".

My order arrived and all was good - the invoice showed they charged card "B". However, when I checked my account from credit card "A" and saw the charge.

I called Del-ton today and asked for assistance.

What the website doesn't tell you is you really are NOT changing your order by going through the steps online. When the original order is placed that gets printed as a hard-copy. Unless you specifically call and ask for them to change their hard-copy, changing online does nothing.

Del-ton's solution was for me to return my parts (minus 15% re-stocking fee) then re-doing the entire order. They would not re-credit card "A" and charge correctly to card "B". That's against accounting policy. She said she asked the owner of the business and he too refused.

The advice I got from them was: "not to sound ugly, but I'd think if you wanted to change your card you would have not only changed it online, but called in."

My reply: "I would think online you'd have some indication a customer cannot 'change an order' prior to shipping WITHOUT calling in to double check.."

Her reply "I would think you would have planned better."

So - that's it - Just be DOUBLY SURE you call in and check to confirm the changes you make ONLINE prior to an order being shipped were actually done.

They've lost a customer - I've cancelled anything else I had order with them. Their product seems great. That's where it ends, IMO. Something simple as saving me a decent amount of money - based on my good-faith the changes I'd made PRIOR to their charging me would have kept me.
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:30 PM   #25
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Dmp.

While I understand your frustation, you found a flaw in their billing system, something they need to fix.

As a merchant retailer, I understand why they do not want to refund and charge you other card. Every credit card transaction incurs fees. Yhou as the buyer don't see them. But the merchant gets hit with a flat fee and like a 2.5% to 3% fee (this is dependant on the processing company and type of card). Every transaction gets hit with this. When they charge your card A. Then again when they chargeback (refund card A). Then again when they charge card B.

That's 7.5% to 9% lost. That sucks. But how they handled it is BS. Obviously they are jut trying to discourage you from making them do this. I am not condoning this behavoir. Just explaining their motivation.

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Old 12-09-2011, 02:49 PM   #26
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Hey, thanks much. I appreciate your perspective on it. It's been nearly 3 years with Del-Ton, and I'm sure they've gone on to make hundreds of thousands more dollars; and have made many happy customers. Sometimes, however, and I know I'm not telling you anything you don't already know, but sometimes their desire to hang on to a few percent in fees costs them a customer; as it did for me. So, buyer-beware. Don't order from del-ton without knowing their billing system, and their customer service practices do not allow changing a fund source based on what one sees online.

:beers:

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Old 12-09-2011, 10:01 PM   #27
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My solution: spend the same amount or close to it on a higher quality AR from a company known for great CS.

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Old 12-11-2011, 02:32 AM   #28
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My solution: spend the same amount or close to it on a higher quality AR from a company known for great CS.
Since I am interested.... Such as?
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Old 12-11-2011, 07:38 AM   #29
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I've seen PSA make a great effort. S&W are well known for their CS. Rainer Arms Has awesome cs. I've heard LaRue has a lifteime warranty on all their rifles, INCLUDING barrels. Those are off thetop of kmy head. Spikes also I beilieve has a liftime warranty. Think Spike's is manufacturer warranty...

Don't expecg squat from Blackthorne of apparently DTI.

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Old 12-11-2011, 12:08 PM   #30
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Shows how behind the times I am. I hadn't heard of most of those! I've known there is an increasing number of manufacturers of the AR platform, but I need to get with it!

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