Let's End The AR BS! - Page 31
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Let's End The AR BS!


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Old 12-11-2012, 12:03 PM   #301
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Ok; as long as there is no more infighting. Some people take stuff too personal.
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:15 PM   #302
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Yep. Please let us know if it goes south.
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:51 AM   #303
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Great thread..

I know the Mods might be unenthusiastic, if I pick up on this one statement from a few months back, but I want to give my middle-of-the-road 2 cents:

for what its worth I was never a huge brand snob, started out with 2 mid-range guns Stag and RRA (back then when the 3 tier system was more meaningful than now) but I did feel very leery of entry level AR's back then.

But recently I thought about it; since we never fire our civlian rifles full auto the stress on them will be way less.
This is a huge factor in the material and QC you need for a given system.
I've spent years in Gov't Acquistions so looking at requirements and intended system use is key to evaluating any tool you get.

So whether you run a DPMS or Delton instead of a BCM or Noveske I doubt it will make any noticable difference in any situation that doesnt involve a lot of full auto fire.

Now if you are a triple canopy contractor you'd probably want a DD , or Noveske etc (at a level of workmanship which our troops dont even get) and it might only cost you 2 days pay depending on what you do.

But the quality of entry level AR's has become so good compared to years past, its ridiculous and they will serve the rest of us quite well, even if we ever <do> get in a high volume shooting situation (Heck the Delton Extreme Duty M4gery has not just HPT/MPI bolts but a CHF barrell as well, which is way more than our troops get, if they made it in a mid lenght thats what I would get)

PS: My so called mid range gun, my RRA ,compares to the army issue M16 and then M4 I used to carry. Carpenter 158 extractor, O ring, MPI bolt and barrell, accurate etc etc.
And frankly since we dont shoot full auto.. sometimes I am even wondering if even our entry level AR's are not starting to be a bit overkill in terms of semi-auto only since we run them very close to the god of "mil spec" ... which was written to support full auto fire.

And I LOVE the 16 inch barrel (which is not mil spec) especiacally if supported by a mid lenght gas system (also not mil spec).
The 16 inch barrel is a great compromise between handiness and ballistic performance and the Army almost picked it over 14.5 inch for general issue.

Last edited by bluez; 12-12-2012 at 01:55 AM.
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Old 12-12-2012, 11:07 AM   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluez View Post
Great thread..

I know the Mods might be unenthusiastic, if I pick up on this one statement from a few months back, but I want to give my middle-of-the-road 2 cents:

for what its worth I was never a huge brand snob, started out with 2 mid-range guns Stag and RRA (back then when the 3 tier system was more meaningful than now) but I did feel very leery of entry level AR's back then.

But recently I thought about it; since we never fire our civlian rifles full auto the stress on them will be way less.
This is a huge factor in the material and QC you need for a given system.
I've spent years in Gov't Acquistions so looking at requirements and intended system use is key to evaluating any tool you get.

So whether you run a DPMS or Delton instead of a BCM or Noveske I doubt it will make any noticable difference in any situation that doesnt involve a lot of full auto fire.

Now if you are a triple canopy contractor you'd probably want a DD , or Noveske etc (at a level of workmanship which our troops dont even get) and it might only cost you 2 days pay depending on what you do.

But the quality of entry level AR's has become so good compared to years past, its ridiculous and they will serve the rest of us quite well, even if we ever <do> get in a high volume shooting situation (Heck the Delton Extreme Duty M4gery has not just HPT/MPI bolts but a CHF barrell as well, which is way more than our troops get, if they made it in a mid lenght thats what I would get)

PS: My so called mid range gun, my RRA ,compares to the army issue M16 and then M4 I used to carry. Carpenter 158 extractor, O ring, MPI bolt and barrell, accurate etc etc.
And frankly since we dont shoot full auto.. sometimes I am even wondering if even our entry level AR's are not starting to be a bit overkill in terms of semi-auto only since we run them very close to the god of "mil spec" ... which was written to support full auto fire.

And I LOVE the 16 inch barrel (which is not mil spec) especiacally if supported by a mid lenght gas system (also not mil spec).
The 16 inch barrel is a great compromise between handiness and ballistic performance and the Army almost picked it over 14.5 inch for general issue.
bluez,
Most of what you said is true, however, there are a few brands out there in which you are better off if they do fail to fire, not many, but a few.Vulcan/Blackthorne/Hesse to name one mfr. And with the slide fire and a few similar devices out there, there are some who are putting as much as if not more stress on their AR's than PVT Snuffy. And it is a good thing that there are companies out there willing to commit "overkill" on the quality of their weapons. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. The last thing in the world you need to hear when your life depends on it when you fire your weapon is click.
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Last edited by fsted2a; 12-12-2012 at 11:09 AM.
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Old 12-22-2013, 01:08 AM   #305
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A blast from the past?

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Old 01-23-2014, 02:03 AM   #306
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Its weird. Everyone here in Kentucky thought it was going to be hard to get ARs and now you can get them for 600 dollars everywhere here. Aks are going for more. I dont see what the big freak out is anymore.
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Old 01-23-2014, 05:59 AM   #307
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A blast from way past (LOL).

AR's are ok, But I have been looking more and more at Pistol Caliber Carbines. I have one in 40 S&W and now looking at one in a lever action 357 Mag. Why, because I can shoot them indoors at a indoor range, use cheaper ammo, don't have to drive 1.3 hours to the range and besides they are cool. Yes, I have an AR and probably will get another in 6.8, but with 6 months of winter weather, why spend the money on something I will shoot not that often.

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Old 01-23-2014, 01:14 PM   #308
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Its weird. Everyone here in Kentucky thought it was going to be hard to get ARs and now you can get them for 600 dollars everywhere here. Aks are going for more. I dont see what the big freak out is anymore.
Some of the mfr's have been dumping AR's on the market, such as the DPMS Oracle, with zero qc, and its hit or miss whether it will be a good product or not. Until Sandy hook, DPMS was starting to put out a decent AR, then they started to dump a bunch of junk on the market which is turning some potential enthusiasts off.
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Old 01-23-2014, 01:27 PM   #309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fsted2a View Post
Some of the mfr's have been dumping AR's on the market, such as the DPMS Oracle, with zero qc, and its hit or miss whether it will be a good product or not. Until Sandy hook, DPMS was starting to put out a decent AR, then they started to dump a bunch of junk on the market which is turning some potential enthusiasts off.

Funny you should say that. Myself and my friend both have bushmasters and they are both very picky about ammo. Im to the point where I wouldnt even trust mine in a battle situation. It is fun to shoot at the range though however neither of ours are highly reliable. ... I have to clean mine after every couple hundred rounds.

Now my other friend has a DPMS that will eat anything that you put in it, wolf , tulamo, usmc and never have as much as a cough. I guess he just got a good one. I guess its just the luck of the draw these days with these ARs. I think I may just trade mine in for a saiga in .223 put a red dot on it and call it a day.
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Old 01-23-2014, 07:42 PM   #310
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From what I have seen, DPMS has some good AR's as well,but the lower end models not so much so. If you buy a $600 gun be prepared to spend$600 more.
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