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Old 07-07-2012, 12:26 AM   #21
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Default This might be a long post...

I have made a few decisions, in part due to your collective counsel. Here's my line of thought:

1) .45acp carbines are very hard to find and there is only 1 AR-15 upper in .45acp that I really considered (the Oly Arms). .45acp really was designed by JMB for the 5" barrel of the 1911. Oh well...

2) If I am going to go with a pistol caliber carbine, probably 9mm is the way to go for all sorts of reasons.

3) The .223 round would be more effective than either, plus would allow me to stay in the AR-15 platform.

I wrote up a few lists (I'm a list person) of costs for each of three options.

Option #1: Pistol Caliber Carbine, 9mm $1395

Beretta Cx4 Storm (92FS) 9mm $800
5 magazines $100
Top and side rails $80
Streamlight TLR-1 $95
Vortex Strikefire $170
200 9mm HP $150 (Winchester Ranger Talon 127gr. +p+)

Option #2: Less expensive tactical carbine, .223 $1185

Kel Tec SU-16C $600
Magpul MOE rail $10
Streamlight TLR-1 $95
Vortex Strikefire $170
Kel Tec sling mount $20
Single-point sling $40
AR-15 magazines (5) 20-round GI-style $50
200 .223 SP $200 (Winchester Ranger LE 64gr.)

Option #3: AR-15 Carbine, .223 $1660

Bravo Co. AR-15 M4 14.5” Mid-Length Lightweight upper 1:7” $500
Magpul MOE mid handguard FDE $35
QD Micro Flush sling mount $20
SI Defense Bolt Carrier Group $110
DSA Charging Handle $20
Magpul rear BUIS FDE $60
Vortex Strikefire $170
MOE rails (5 slots) $10
Streamlight TLR-1 $95
Stripped Lower $110
Ergo FDE LPK (no trigger)—Palmetto $55
CMMG 2-stage Trigger $120
Magpul CTR stock milspec FDE $80
DSA Buffer Tube assembly milspec $35
Magpul PMag FDE 20rd (3) $45
200 .223 HP $195 (Hornady TAP 75gr.)

I don't see why I would get the 9mm carbine after seeing these numbers.

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Old 07-07-2012, 12:39 AM   #22
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Well after a trip to Walmart today, one argument for 9mm is Federal Champion 9mm $19.97 per 100 and American Eagle .223 $6.97 per 20 (about $35 per 100 vs. $20 for 9mm). Still I'd rather go with the 5.56/.223 AR.

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Old 07-07-2012, 12:47 AM   #23
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My 9mm carbine:



I've added some stuff to it. Priced around $600. Also available in .45.

www.jrcarbines.com

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Old 07-07-2012, 12:59 AM   #24
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That looks like a Glock mag? Just Rights are very hard to find. Is the receiver polymer? How's the trigger?

Tell us more, you can't leave us hanging like that. JR Carbines are still very new (at least to me) and I'd love to hear your thoughts.

The 45 uses 8-round mags. That is just totally unacceptable to me. I'd have to go with 9mm if I were to go that direction.

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Old 07-07-2012, 01:04 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by CHLChris View Post
That looks like a Glock mag? Just Rights are very hard to find. Is the receiver polymer? How's the trigger?

Tell us more, you can't leave us hanging like that. JR Carbines are still very new (at least to me) and I'd love to hear your thoughts.

The 45 uses 8-round mags. That is just totally unacceptable to me. I'd have to go with 9mm if I were to go that direction.

Yes, it uses Glock mags for both 9mm and .45ACP versions (which you can interchange). 33 round mags eat up the ammo fast! Fun to shoot and mine has been reliable thus far (800 rounds of varying brands of FMJ ammo). Trigger is crisp (don't ask me the pull weight).

Here are the details.

The JR Carbine is an ambidextrous, straight blowback-operated, semi-automatic, pistol-caliber carbine with telescoping 6-position collapsible buttstock and free-floating quadrail forend.

Product Features:

■Semi-automatic pistol-caliber carbine
■Simple, reliable, straight blowback operation
■Ambidextrous bolt - configurable for left or right-hand ejection
■Bolt handle switchable to left or right side
■Converts to other pistol-calibers with simple conversion kit (available separately)
■Magazine included - Glock or 1911 depending on model
■Lightweight 16-1/4" barrel
■Free-floating quadrail forend
■Picatinny rail machined into top of receiver
■Telescoping 6-position collapsible M-4 style buttstock
■Receiver, trigger housing and magazine well machined from aerospace grade 6061T-6
aluminum with black hardcoat anodizing for extra protection and durability
■Standard M-4 buffer tube, buttstock, and pistol grip
■Utilizes standard M-4/AR-15 furniture and trigger components
■Lightweight - approximately 6.5 lbs.
■Overall length: buttstock extended 33-1/2", collapsed 30-1/4"
■Made in the USA, in New York State


Calibers and Models Offered:
■9mm Standard, Restricted State (CT, MA, NJ, NY), and California Compliant
■9mm Refurbished - Standard, Restricted State, and California Compliant
■.40S&W Standard, Restricted State, and California Compliant
■.45ACP - Glock Magazine Based - Standard, Restricted State, and California Compliant
■.45 ACP - 1911 Magazine Based - Standard and Restricted State

Combo Kits Offered:
■.45ACP Standard or Restricted State model plus either a 9mm or .40S&W Caliber Conversion Kit
■.45ACP California Compliant model plus either a 9mm or .40S&W Caliber Conversion Kit
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Old 07-07-2012, 01:10 AM   #26
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Noooooooo!!!!! I can read the website.

Talk to us. Tell us what YOU think. Have you shot it? What is the fit and finish like? Since you can't shoot +p ammo, what are you going to load it with? That sort of stuff.

Yep, you're right about the Glock mags for 45.

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Old 07-07-2012, 01:16 AM   #27
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Noooooooo!!!!! I can read the website.

Talk to us. Tell us what YOU think. Have you shot it? What is the fit and finish like? Since you can't shoot +p ammo, what are you going to load it with? That sort of stuff.
I have 800 rounds through it. Works like a charm. You can use +P since the redesigned the innards. I've used mostly 115 gr. ammo, the cheapest I can find at the time. Remington, Federal, Blazer Brass and Metal, USAAmmo, Freedom Munitions.

Recoil is light. It is a little extra work to break it down because you have to remove the buttstock to remove the bolt, but it is easy once you get the hang of it. If you have more questions, feel free to ask.

Here is a short video of my son shooting it a few weeks ago and my ass blocking the camera.

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Old 08-04-2012, 06:15 PM   #28
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Hey all! In my constant search for the perfect gun to fill a particular role, I have switched up my AR a little bit to fill this role of home defense carbine for right now. It is a 20", so not really a carbine, but I removed some things to make it lighter, zeroed the iron sights for 50 yards, and will be throwing on an EOTech or Aimpoint pretty soon.

I'm still looking for the perfect carbine, though. I am looking right now at the Mech Tech CCU upper for a Glock handgun frame. They are reported to be really high quality and would give me a reason to buy another handgun.

I'd be going with the Glock 20 in 10mm!! We're talking 1380 ft/s and 1000 ft-lbs. of energy out of 16" of barrel! Very tough to beat that. The Glock gives it 15 rounds and I still have a handgun that would be good for a trail gun, since 10mm beats .357mag every day.

Something like this, but with an AR-15 stock and sights:

glk-20basic-20with-20lower-20web-20size.jpg  
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Old 08-04-2012, 07:50 PM   #29
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I've got a list of firearms that I need in my collection before I just go into "buy cuz it's fun" mode. Three of my needs are a home defense carbine (short and shoulder-fired), I need a second gun that fires .45acp (everyone knows that two is better than one), and I need a second AR-15 (parts interchange is important). Eventually, I'd like to have 3 separate guns to fill all 3 roles, but for now, I am thinking a single AR-15 in 45acp might do the trick.

Olympic Arms makes a smokin' 45acp upper with proprietary mags that fit a standard lower. Then I'd build a pretty standard lower from parts. It would cost about $1200 with a good trigger and mid-range red-dot scope.

What do y'all think about .45acp carbine vs. .223/5.56 for home defense (not talking 100 yards-plus, I've got a 5.56 20" AR for that).

For the .45ACP route, I would go with a MAC11 or HK USC
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Old 08-04-2012, 07:53 PM   #30
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Magpul rear BUIS FDE $60

Magpul CTR stock milspec FDE $80

I can help you save a little bit on these components. I have them on sale...$44.99 for the MBUS and $68 for the CTR, free shipping...plus you save an additional 5% using the forum discount code.
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