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Old 06-08-2012, 02:58 AM   #241
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This thread could go on forever but I have a couple comments. 1. Most gun stores have very knowledgeable people who have seen many different type and brands of guns. One persons comment was on cheaper guns there is a bigger profit margin...exactly the opposite the more expensive gun the more we charge. Most of us add a certain % to the cost, so more cost more profit.
2. Now honest gun dealers would not sell a product they did not know was good. We sell DPMS almost exclusively and they go like hot cakes. I find them to be some of the tightest and best made or I wouldn't sell them. 3. Sell a bad product and it comes back on your store. We are gun manufacturers so we can make a full auto AR15/M16. The one we made was a DPMS, this gun has shot 1,000 of rds and never missed a lick, except for a bad mag. We fire it at machine gun shoots where 20 rd mags are fired one after the other. The gun get so hot you can't even touch the barrel, still keep on firing. IMHO DPMS is a great gun and you won't be disappointed with one, save yourself a bunch of money.
1. BS, I can't even count the times I've played dumb and was given a days worth of bad information at a LGS. They (some arrogant prick behind the counter and his sidekick w/ a magnet) once tried to tell me that xm193 was armor piercing steel core. I laughed In their face and rattled off different ammo types and their purpose/use.

2. They mislead customers all the time. I have stood there and listened to them do so. I imagine part of the reason you sell DPMS has to do w/ your attitude toward them. I would guess that you push them quite hard. Another reason is the name is known/recognizable to your regular guy off the street who goes off, looks just like the ones the soldiers use it must be GTG. They are also a couple hundred less than a higher quality AR. In most cases it works well for them. Then again only about 1% run their ARs as they were designed.

3.See above. Most never really get used. I would imagine these manufacturers realize this and are smart enough to cut just the right corners as to not cause a problem.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:13 AM   #242
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Working in a gun store doesn't make you an expert. Just as cooking in a kitchen doesn't make you a chef. That much you have already show us. You keep saying you never had a problem with DPMS. You make it as though 1000 rounds is alot of rounds to go through without a hitch. I recommend people shoot at least that many rounds just test fire their guns or sort things out. I've gone through 1000 rounds in one day. Running drills and plinking. Taken 8 hr a day courses and going through 1200+ rounds of .223 and 300 rounds of pistol. With 10 round magazines. (Sigh) 1000 rounds, that's nothing. Open your mind up a bit. Tell us the differences between the various makes and models. If you don't know, there's no time like the present.

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Old 06-08-2012, 12:05 PM   #243
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My my quite a response. First let me tell you I am no expert and do not pretend to be. I have experience with different AR15's and I can tell you the ones people like and the ones they tell me they paid too much for. Overwhelmingly the public tells me DPMS is their best value for the money.
And you have it backwards. I do not push DPMS because I sell them, I sell them because they are the best value for the money and are a high quality firearm. In my gun stores we try to give the customer the very best advice and provide the best knowledge we have and we never try to give them bad advice. the biggest problem we have in gun stores is customers who pretend to be "experts" and give advice to customers which is wrong. I do like your tactic of playing dumb in gun stores and we appreciate that. This is my last post on this subject, thank you for listening

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Old 06-08-2012, 12:33 PM   #244
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My my quite a response. First let me tell you I am no expert and do not pretend to be. I have experience with different AR15's and I can tell you the ones people like and the ones they tell me they paid too much for. Overwhelmingly the public tells me DPMS is their best value for the money.
And you have it backwards. I do not push DPMS because I sell them, I sell them because they are the best value for the money and are a high quality firearm. In my gun stores we try to give the customer the very best advice and provide the best knowledge we have and we never try to give them bad advice. the biggest problem we have in gun stores is customers who pretend to be "experts" and give advice to customers which is wrong. I do like your tactic of playing dumb in gun stores and we appreciate that. This is my last post on this subject, thank you for listening

If you've read thru this thread , you would see that everything you've said, has been said before, replied to before, beaten to death before, etc...

It's not that they are bad points, it's that both sides have what they think are good points. Some of them are great points.

It's like the Ford vs. Chevy debates I used to hear when I was a kid.
Except the guys who are putting down DPMS , or challenging your presuppositions regarding the "less expensive" guns have a very good point.
But then so do those who don't plan on doing much WITH their AR's.
I'm pretty convinced that neither side will change their mind.

On the other hand, I see both sides, and HAVE been convinced to look at OTHER manufacturers who are not very expensive... such as Paramus Arms.
So, the debate HAS persuaded me to open my mind some.

Myself; I'm not opposed to paying $1500 IF I'm going to get more value.
But it doesn't seem that's necessary to get good quality equipment. DPMS is NOT the only inexpensive manufacturer out there.
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:30 PM   #245
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Originally Posted by patriot View Post
My my quite a response. First let me tell you I am no expert and do not pretend to be. I have experience with different AR15's and I can tell you the ones people like and the ones they tell me they paid too much for. Overwhelmingly the public tells me DPMS is their best value for the money.
And you have it backwards. I do not push DPMS because I sell them, I sell them because they are the best value for the money and are a high quality firearm. In my gun stores we try to give the customer the very best advice and provide the best knowledge we have and we never try to give them bad advice. the biggest problem we have in gun stores is customers who pretend to be "experts" and give advice to customers which is wrong. I do like your tactic of playing dumb in gun stores and we appreciate that. This is my last post on this subject, thank you for listening
Dont take it wrong, You may have a great store with great knowledge , but what the guys are trying to pass on is the fact there are alot of gun stores/ shops that arent worth a crap at being knowledgable about certain products . We have one of those around here but for the most part we have great gun shops with knowledgable people and a couple of great gunsmiths locally . I like to support my local shops but sometimes they cant get me the best deal , I dont mind paying a extra $25-30 for a firearm if it helps keep them in business but when the spread is $100 I cant always give them my business but I do try . There is nothing wrong with a DPMS or any other bargain priced rifle . There will always be a bad one in every bunch regardless of what brand it is . Regardless every single one of them is fixable usually with minor work and $$$ .
DPMS has been around a long time and longer than most and they have their products on the shelves in every Bass Pro, Cabelas, and Gander Mountain out there and that gets them the sales they have and the reputable name they have
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:25 PM   #246
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....OTHER manufacturers who are not very expensive... such as Paramus Arms.....
oOoOOoOoo Not on the Master list....hrm googled them, no luck. Do you have any more info on them?
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Old 06-09-2012, 12:19 PM   #247
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oOoOOoOoo Not on the Master list....hrm googled them, no luck. Do you have any more info on them?
Terribly sorry,

I misspoke ... it's PALMETTO state armory. It was mentioned to me by one of the other members.

Patriot: look at the date of the first post. It's from 2008!!!

This subject has been pretty well-debated. You're just a new voice. Don't go away mad. Don't go away.

Don't take it personally.
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Old 07-26-2012, 08:43 PM   #248
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I'd go with the flat platform and add a red dot infront of the iron flip sight. I say this is the red dot can give you a faster response to target acquisition. I you red dot fails for sopme reason your iron sight is right there for easy use. Most of the time I see people add a red dot with no back up sights. red dot goes out you pretty much have to guess. If you line your irons up and then set you red dot infront they should be in line with each other and you get the best of both worlds. can't do this with a carry handle

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Old 07-26-2012, 08:44 PM   #249
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sorry about the typos

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Old 07-26-2012, 08:52 PM   #250
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see attachment. exactly what im talkin about. dont even have to fold them down if you dont want to

gun.jpg  
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