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-   -   AR Lower Dimensional help (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f20/ar-lower-dimensional-help-94731/)

partdeux 07-31-2013 04:58 AM

AR Lower Dimensional help
 
Local forum, one of the moderators arranged a custom group buy through a "top shelf" mfg...

I haven't picked mine up yet, but the people that bought these and picked them up are reporting they are pieces of crap, with many dimensions being out of print...

So, is there a print so I can at least measure some of the hole dimensions? I don't have access to a CMM or layout equipment to do the inspection justice :(

MFG has changed the terms of the contract so many times, it's ridiculous.

I'm disgusted with the whole purchase... was so looking forward to doing a custom build.

CGS 07-31-2013 03:10 PM

You're looking for an AR15 upper receiver print? Just google: ar15 lower receiver blueprint

What exactly are they reporting being wrong with the dimensions? If the outer forging marks don't quite line up that's nothing but cosmetic. I don't think they ever really 100% line up unless you have a matched upper to lower. Recently did a build with a HK upper and Aero lower. There were some dimensional differences, but all the critical holes and cuts were in the proper locations. The mismatch was not more than cosmetic and you wouldn't notice without staring at the gun. For example a guy wlking by at the range would never ever notice.

Quentin 07-31-2013 03:21 PM

If there's truly a problem, maybe your group can return the receivers - as a group? A "top shelf" maker should take care of a functional problem. And even if it's just cosmetic you'd expect some effort to be made. Any of the guys successfully built one yet, or what problems? Are these billet?

CGS 07-31-2013 03:54 PM

Post some pics.

partdeux 08-01-2013 01:02 AM

I have not picked my receiver up yet. Nobody has been able to actually build one from the lower. Pin holes are oversize and undersize, tube threads significantly undersize.

"top shelf" mfg has his heels dug in and is offering to remake them without the customization features, sometime before december, or discount the unbuildable lower. the anodizing is actually flaking off.

I've seen a lot of internet scams pulled off over the years, this one takes the cake... and I fell for it. Apparently caveat emptor went to sleep in my brain. Part of his excuse, he received a big order from Para. I looked up the google satellite view of his FFL address, and it looks like a house out in the sticks.

They are billet, supposed to be 7075(?), but someone is claiming it's 6061(?) I don't know, haven't even begun to look into what the diff maybe.

In retrospect, this deal was screaming problems the entire time... but the prior similar deal (with different party's) went off without a hitch and people LOVE their units.

A local gun smith who also got ripped off has offered to get involved and help this top shelf mfg machine the products and I had a long talk this morning... I'm less comfortable after hearing some additional things this morning.

I was very excited about building this "custom" AR, but the luster is long gone now.

KG7IL 08-01-2013 01:11 AM

My local shop has units you can pick up and touch (and measure if you wish) before you buy. I love LGS

partdeux 08-01-2013 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KG7IL (Post 1321825)
My local shop has units you can pick up and touch (and measure if you wish) before you buy. I love LGS

{sigh}

This was sold as a customized uber high quality product. Anybody can go into the LGS and get a good unit, but how many can get ripped off as easily as I and 99 of my friends could? Apparently 100 could.

CGS 08-01-2013 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by partdeux (Post 1321817)
I have not picked my receiver up yet. Nobody has been able to actually build one from the lower. Pin holes are oversize and undersize, tube threads significantly undersize.

"top shelf" mfg has his heels dug in and is offering to remake them without the customization features, sometime before december, or discount the unbuildable lower. the anodizing is actually flaking off.

I've seen a lot of internet scams pulled off over the years, this one takes the cake... and I fell for it. Apparently caveat emptor went to sleep in my brain. Part of his excuse, he received a big order from Para. I looked up the google satellite view of his FFL address, and it looks like a house out in the sticks.

They are billet, supposed to be 7075(?), but someone is claiming it's 6061(?) I don't know, haven't even begun to look into what the diff maybe.

In retrospect, this deal was screaming problems the entire time... but the prior similar deal (with different party's) went off without a hitch and people LOVE their units.

A local gun smith who also got ripped off has offered to get involved and help this top shelf mfg machine the products and I had a long talk this morning... I'm less comfortable after hearing some additional things this morning.

I was very excited about building this "custom" AR, but the luster is long gone now.

VERY interested in who this "top shelf" manufacturer is.

How much did you expect to save? You can get Aero lowers for $75.

Since Aero literally makes half the lowers on the market they kind of set the standard. You can get a S&W or even a DD lower for $180 at a LGS. Again how much did you expect to save in this group buy?

partdeux 08-01-2013 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGS (Post 1321964)
VERY interested in who this "top shelf" manufacturer is.

How much did you expect to save? You can get Aero lowers for $75.

Since Aero literally makes half the lowers on the market they kind of set the standard. You can get a S&W or even a DD lower for $180 at a LGS. Again how much did you expect to save in this group buy?

{removed mfg name... for now}

It was never about saving money, it was about the customized logo... and the superior "quality" from a "top shelf" mfg.

Quentin 08-01-2013 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by partdeux (Post 1322600)
...

It was never about saving money, it was about the customized logo... and the superior "quality" from a "top shelf" mfg.

Sorry to hear about the problem, P2. Sooner or later many of us will think about a custom billet lower and usually it goes well. I was lucky with my US Army lower plus the custom engraving turned out well but no doubt it could have turned sour. And of course you don't get to see it till it gets to your FFL.

Certainly not your fault or the others in your group buy. You might settle for small issues in a cheap forged lower but not when it's a custom design. I hope you guys can get this resolved. Anyway, good luck!

You may be wise to keep the maker somewhat anonymous (at least low key) for now, during the negotiation process. If they don't work with you, then you do have strong bargaining power of 100 dissatisfied customers going out to various forums and telling the world what X did.


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