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Old 06-28-2012, 02:24 PM   #81
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Quentin,
If I am not mistaken, there was a thread here a couple of months ago about a DPMS gas key that had a half-@$$ed stake on it, and you made a comment on it. Do you remember it? I think it might be relevant here.
On a side note, SOME of DPMS parts are not what I would call teir 1 quality. Some are pretty good.
There was and it was only a couple weeks ago. A very clear picture of poor staking in a brand new D PMS by a new member. Hopefully he'll drop it in here.
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Old 06-28-2012, 02:49 PM   #82
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There was and it was only a couple weeks ago. A very clear picture of poor staking in a brand new D PMS by a new member. Hopefully he'll drop it in here.
http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f20/updrades-make-ar-more-reliable-66740/index4.html
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Old 06-28-2012, 03:32 PM   #83
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Members that support/encourage the purchase of ARs from corner cutting, immoral companies like DPMS should receive a week long ban. It's a disservice to those who aren't knowledgeable to tell the difference or are looking to be stroked. W/ all the decent manufacturers out there, there isn't an excuse.

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Old 06-28-2012, 03:51 PM   #84
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There was and it was only a couple weeks ago. A very clear picture of poor staking in a brand new D PMS by a new member. Hopefully he'll drop it in here.
I have never seen a "brand new" DPMS key that was not anodized and was pitted like that.

I googled for "AR 15 blows up" and "short stroking" but couldn't find anything on DPMS's--but did get hits for the S&W, Colt and Stag. Does that mean anything at all on the overall reliability of these other weapons? I don't think so.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:01 PM   #85
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I have never seen a "brand new" DPMS key that was not anodized and was pitted like that...
The OP in that thread says it's brand new. His flash my have washed out the color.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:07 PM   #86
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Members that support/encourage the purchase of ARs from corner cutting, immoral companies like DPMS should receive a week long ban. It's a disservice to those who aren't knowledgeable to tell the difference or are looking to be stroked. W/ all the decent manufacturers out there, there isn't an excuse.
OK--some how you're implying that I should be punished for having purchased two DPMS rifles which have worked as well or better than any other AR I've ever owned or fired and therefore recommend them as a good value. If you are so convinced that there is an inherent danger and inferiority of these weapons--your beef is with the manufacturer--not me.

DPMS is always ready to take calls and get one of the guys that actually builds them on the line to address whatever questions you might have about their weapons. Incidentally, I'm told 40% of their employees are x-military.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:29 PM   #87
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I have never seen a "brand new" DPMS key that was not anodized and was pitted like that.

I googled for "AR 15 blows up" and couldn't find anything on DPMS's--but did get hits for the S&W, Colt and Stag. Does that mean anything at all on the overall reliability of these other weapons? I don't think so.
I really didn't intend to turn this into a pissing contest. There are several conditions that can cause a weapon to have a catastrophic failure which may not have anything to do with QC, such as water in the gas tube, cookoff, ....
From personal experience, my first AR was a DPMS. I got it cheap, for 450 bucks at a LGS out of the box. It was a carbine, and either the threads on the lower or the threads on the buffer tube weren't CNC'd, which meant that the tube didn't completely go over the buffer detente, and after a few hundred rounds, the buffer detente popped out, which led to a double tap of the hammer. The second time the hammer hit the firing pin, the round wasn't quite seated in the chamber, and resulted in the upper fragmenting when the round fired. I got lucky and nothing hit me. The LGS that I bought the gun from swapped me out with another AR (essential arms), which I still have to this day.
DPMS has been in business for a good long time, and if incidents like mine were happening on a regular basis, they would have had their doors shut a long time ago. However, their quality control record is less than that of other similarly priced AR's, which is why some of us don't recommend them.
The bolt carrier assembly on the one I had wasn't anodized, by the way. The majority of the bolt carrier assemblies I have seen (and I realize there are exceptions) will have the full auto ones anodized, and the semi auto carriers non anodized.
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:46 AM   #88
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I really didn't intend to turn this into a pissing contest. There are several conditions that can cause a weapon to have a catastrophic failure which may not have anything to do with QC, such as water in the gas tube, cookoff, ....
From personal experience, my first AR was a DPMS. I got it cheap, for 450 bucks at a LGS out of the box. It was a carbine, and either the threads on the lower or the threads on the buffer tube weren't CNC'd, which meant that the tube didn't completely go over the buffer detente, and after a few hundred rounds, the buffer detente popped out, which led to a double tap of the hammer. The second time the hammer hit the firing pin, the round wasn't quite seated in the chamber, and resulted in the upper fragmenting when the round fired. I got lucky and nothing hit me. The LGS that I bought the gun from swapped me out with another AR (essential arms), which I still have to this day.
DPMS has been in business for a good long time, and if incidents like mine were happening on a regular basis, they would have had their doors shut a long time ago. However, their quality control record is less than that of other similarly priced AR's, which is why some of us don't recommend them.
The bolt carrier assembly on the one I had wasn't anodized, by the way. The majority of the bolt carrier assemblies I have seen (and I realize there are exceptions) will have the full auto ones anodized, and the semi auto carriers non anodized.
Did you contact DPMS directly about the failure? Are you absolutely sure the weapon was brand new--sounds suspiciously cheap to me?

Glad you were not injured in a catastrophic failure.

I have used and recommended DPMS AR's for a couple of years now. My experiences and that of those who I've recommended them to have been nothing but extreme satisfaction with a weapon that fires reliably and gets fabulous groupings for a lower-tier priced gun--though my LRT SASS is hardly a cheap weapon. I've found that as long as I follow the manufacturer's warranty and usage guidelines they are great values for the average recreational civilian shooter.

I'm probably not going to change that opinion despite the obvious bias among this group here--though I have no agenda to go out and market these things--I simply have said I've used them, like them and would readily recommend them to others.

I also own and enjoy an XD 45 and ruger LCP. Are these similarly bad weapons with their share of problems?
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Old 06-29-2012, 01:39 PM   #89
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Did you contact DPMS directly about the failure? Are you absolutely sure the weapon was brand new--sounds suspiciously cheap to me?

Glad you were not injured in a catastrophic failure.

I have used and recommended DPMS AR's for a couple of years now. My experiences and that of those who I've recommended them to have been nothing but extreme satisfaction with a weapon that fires reliably and gets fabulous groupings for a lower-tier priced gun--though my LRT SASS is hardly a cheap weapon. I've found that as long as I follow the manufacturer's warranty and usage guidelines they are great values for the average recreational civilian shooter.

I'm probably not going to change that opinion despite the obvious bias among this group here--though I have no agenda to go out and market these things--I simply have said I've used them, like them and would readily recommend them to others.

I also own and enjoy an XD 45 and ruger LCP. Are these similarly bad weapons with their share of problems?
I didn't contact DPMS, but I am sure my LGS did, since they didn't have a problem swapping me out with another rifle. It was still in the box with the owners manual, and was sold to me as a new gun, so I assumed it was new. Been a few years, so I can't GUARANTEE it was new. I didn't notice any scratches or other signs of useage.
At the time, I was putting more rounds through the rifle than anyone else on the range, and I had just learned to bumpfire, so the gun was taking a beating. If I had been more gentle, it may have lasted a lot longer, or on the other hand, it may have blown up on me when I didn't wear eye protection.
Also, at the time I was not knowledgeable as I am now about how everything worked on the AR, and how one part can lead to failures on other parts. A caveat; a couple of years later, some manufacturers, to include Bushmaster and POF have started either putting an alignment lip or cutting a small indentation where the buffer detente is suppose to go on their carbine buffer tubes to make sure the detente stays secure, so the problem may not have been exclusive to DPMS. A lot of AR/M16 manufacturers have come and gone, and I am sure not all of them used the CNC machinery to cut threads on the receivers and buffer tubes.
As I stated before, DPMS is not among the worst brands, and now that I have the knowledge and skills that I didn't have then, I wouldn't be afraid to take one if I were offered a super sweet deal on one. I still don't recommend it to someone just starting out, just because they don't know what to look for.
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Old 06-29-2012, 02:14 PM   #90
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You were bump-firing lots of rounds at the time of failure?

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