What's the REAL accuracy of an AK chambered in 7,62x39?300-400m! - Page 2
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Old 10-09-2013, 10:05 PM   #11
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There are some truly amazing shooters and AK-47 rifles. Shooting a 16" gong at 650 yards and never missing with iron sights. The AK front sight will blank out a 16" target at 650 yards making this a phenomenal display of marksmanship.
Have you ever watched scope sighted rifles score every time at 594.12 Meters. Humm?

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Old 10-09-2013, 10:40 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by nitestalker View Post
There are some truly amazing shooters and AK-47 rifles. Shooting a 16" gong at 650 yards and never missing with iron sights. The AK front sight will blank out a 16" target at 650 yards making this a phenomenal display of marksmanship.
Have you ever watched scope sighted rifles score every time at 594.12 Meters. Humm?
Sorry to imply that I NEVER miss the gong, but i believe it to me, not the rifle, that misses. I put the ladder on 700, and hold at the bottom of the gong. Cuz yea, the sight post will block it out.
Im confused at the sarcastic remark about it being a phenomenal display of marksmanship tho. Try the longer ranges and you'll find its not as hard as some want you to think.
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Old 10-10-2013, 07:26 AM   #13
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You seem to say all that like it is law that an AK at 220 law can only ever hit 1/5 hits, which is completely not true. A good shooter could do much better than 1/5 hits at only 220 yards.
It is not a law....I'm just saying that the AK wasn't designed to be accurate and it is a fact that with iron sights an AK presents several limitations.The sights weren't designed for sharp shooting.
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Old 10-10-2013, 07:34 AM   #14
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Sorry to imply that I NEVER miss the gong, but i believe it to me, not the rifle, that misses. I put the ladder on 700, and hold at the bottom of the gong. Cuz yea, the sight post will block it out.
Im confused at the sarcastic remark about it being a phenomenal display of marksmanship tho. Try the longer ranges and you'll find its not as hard as some want you to think.
You're talking about shootin at the range....see you on the battlefield, than you'll realize what you're talking about.Just answer to this question:Why the marksmans were never equipped with AK?a marksman is someone who can hit a target at 600 yards(effectively,neutralize it), so you should be able to provide marksman fire with an AK-always an at any condition.Can you do it?
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Old 10-10-2013, 04:14 PM   #15
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I think we're getting off track. No where in the OP was it depicted that an accuracy assessment was for a battlefield condition only. Is an AK capable of making hits at those ranges? Yes. Can a bolt gun (of most likely a better cartridge) do it better, with more precision? Yes. Can either be 100% in a battlefield condition, with incoming fire all around you? Probly not. Im not trying to argue just to argue, was just adding in my experience with the rifle at those ranges. I dont care if you believe any of it or not, but if you happen to be in SE Ks sometime, we can go and make it happen. The proof is in the shootin.

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Old 10-10-2013, 05:53 PM   #16
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What were we trying to figure out?

Was it the mechanical accuracy potential of an AK?

The mechanical accuracy potential of a AK built from the ground up for accuracy, and using the most precise custom loaded ammo?

The observed combat accuracy of random AKs from random factories undergoing random maintenance practices with randomly trained guerrilla fighters, and child soldiers thrown into the overall average?

This seems to track pretty far and wide. I've had AK pattern rifles that were unusually accurate with their favorite load when fired from a bench. I've had AK pattern rifles that wouldn't holding better than shotgun patterns. I've seen shooters who could shoot pie plate groups regularly, repeatedly with iron sights at 600 yds and beyond with iron sighted rifles and match loaded ammo. I've seen other folks who couldn't hit a bucket at 10 paces. So, how many variables are we trying to address?

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Old 10-18-2013, 11:10 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by SSGN_Doc View Post
What were we trying to figure out?

Was it the mechanical accuracy potential of an AK?

The mechanical accuracy potential of a AK built from the ground up for accuracy, and using the most precise custom loaded ammo?

The observed combat accuracy of random AKs from random factories undergoing random maintenance practices with randomly trained guerrilla fighters, and child soldiers thrown into the overall average?

This seems to track pretty far and wide. I've had AK pattern rifles that were unusually accurate with their favorite load when fired from a bench. I've had AK pattern rifles that wouldn't holding better than shotgun patterns. I've seen shooters who could shoot pie plate groups regularly, repeatedly with iron sights at 600 yds and beyond with iron sighted rifles and match loaded ammo. I've seen other folks who couldn't hit a bucket at 10 paces. So, how many variables are we trying to address?
Ok.You're right.Let me specify what I meant.
There are several factors, it is true.As you know, except some exemplars(Zastava M76, PSL, Tabuk and some others), the AK is not the best platform to start from if we talk about accurate shooting.
So what do I mean with "AK accuracy"?Pretty simple.It is the average accuracy that can be achieved by ANYONE who shoot the rifle without any kind of "accessories"(Like the bench) and using iron sights only.

How to define the average accuracy?
Average accuracy test:
Find..let's say 5 shooters with different skills(A beginner, an average shooter, a good shooter, an expert shooter, an excellent shooter).Place 5 man-size targets, respectively at 200,300,400,600 and 700m.Then let them shoot 5 rounds with the same AK, the same ammunition at the same conditions(same temperature, same windage, same range,etc).
Then compare the results.

You'll see that the beginner will not be able to hit a target above 200m, the average shooter will be able to hit a target at 300m, the good shooter at 350-400m.The expert and excellent shooters will have really hard time to hit 600-700m targets.So what the final result?All of them can hit a target at 200-400m-THAT'S THE AVERAGE ACCURACY



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Old 10-18-2013, 11:34 AM   #18
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OK, so the average practical accuracy of an average AK performed by an average of shooters. Got it. I Wasn't sure if we were talking about the best possible accuracy.

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Old 10-18-2013, 01:19 PM   #19
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OK, so the average practical accuracy of an average AK performed by an average of shooters. Got it. I Wasn't sure if we were talking about the best possible accuracy.
The accuracy potential of an AK type rifle is fine. It is seldom realized only because of the way the rifles are manufactured. The AK47 was designed originally as a full-auto around an intermediate cartridge meant for the firepower. Precision shooting was not a priority. There isn't enough interest in producing AK based target rifles. I don't think we even know the limits of this platform because there has never been a les Baer ak or any other gold standard. When superior accuracy is called for, we just get something else.
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Old 10-19-2013, 12:33 AM   #20
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The accuracy potential of an AK type rifle is fine. It is seldom realized only because of the way the rifles are manufactured. The AK47 was designed originally as a full-auto around an intermediate cartridge meant for the firepower. Precision shooting was not a priority. There isn't enough interest in producing AK based target rifles. I don't think we even know the limits of this platform because there has never been a les Baer ak or any other gold standard. When superior accuracy is called for, we just get something else.
Part of the point I was making. The original post kind if lead in a few directions. That was why I posted to narrow things down. I understand the potential for increased accuracy is there. I got the clarification I was seeking. It seems we were looking for the true average rather than the true potential.

I'm sure someone could get match grade barrels, and build blueprinted and trued actions, and fit the trunions as true as possible along with hand fitting parts and hone a light, predictable trigger. Then more precise sights with a longer sight radius could be employed, along with hand assembled match ammo. Then you put the platform in the hands of a distinguished marksman and be worlds away from where the, average AK in Average hands performs with average ammo.

I get that, and understand now, where the OP intended the thread to go.
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