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Old 12-10-2010, 12:14 AM   #11
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Great point on the meds JD. I think we can move that over to the SHTF Area.

How many people on just this board alone own at least 1 223/556 or 308/762?

If you think about it. That ammo is going to be GONE in a matter of no time.

Of course you can just wait for people to starve to death then go in and take what they left.

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Old 12-10-2010, 08:12 AM   #12
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If the extreme SHTF scenario ever happens is a really big way (which I hope is very unlikely), I do not think that you should plan on being able to source ammunition in any dependable fashion. So my philosophy is to have 1) numerous weapon/caliber options, and 2) lots of ammo for each. For example:

5.56/.223: 2 x AR-15’s and over 2K in ammo
7.62 x 39 1 x AK and 2K in ammo
.30-06 4 x Milsurps + 1 hunting rifle, 1K in ammo
7.62 x 51/.308 One M1A and 1K in ammo, I need another weapon in .308
.30 carbine 1 carbine + 600 rounds

Then if necessary fall back on others:

1 Mosin-Nagant + 400 rounds
1 SMLE + 200 rounds
1 K98k + 200 rounds
6.5 Jap + 100 rounds

2 x .45 Autos and + 600 rounds
2 x 9mm Autos + 800 rounds
Various other pistols and ammo

3 x 12 gauges + 500 rounds
4 x .22’s + 1K rounds

When all else runs out, I can break out the black powder guns!

I remember a Robert Heinlein post apocalypse Sci-Fi novel I read back in my teenage years where the barter currency of choice was .22 LR cartridges. I guess I should stock on a few more cases of .22.

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Old 12-10-2010, 10:33 AM   #13
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TX I think you hit on something here.

Just like your investment portfolio your weapons portfolio needs to be diversified.

But know that if you do this there are some calibers that are much more available now and you should have the most of them.

I don't agree with trading ammo. Ammo is safety and can feed you if it has to come to that. If you trade it for food your then out food and ammo in a few days.

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Old 12-10-2010, 09:57 PM   #14
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I have both .223 and .308, but for different reasons. First is familiarity. I am former military, so these calibers ring a bell, so to speak. The second reason is i want to hunt for food, in varying animal sizes and at varying ranges. Third, i like accurate rifles and these two calibers are widely available in modern firearms with great accuracy out of the box...see other thread.

Finally, and most importantly, when my son returns from Kuwait next year we can do the shooting sports together with our rifles that share both a common heritage and that "ring a bell" for both of us. It's no secret that Military members often buy civilian equivalents of their favorite guns. In my case, exact rifle copies aren't important but the calibers and their ballistics are. For my son, a duplicate is important.

SHTF was not even a consideration in my choice of calibers, or shotgun...which is the same 12 ga Ithaca model 37 i had as a kid back in western New York (south of Buffalo in the potato country)...with some slight modification. My only personal .22 is my old Remington model 581 from the same era. I do have a couple of modern synthetic stock rifles for other things, like training my wife, etc.

Cost and local availability of ammo was considered, but not much, aside from the coincidence that the .223 is dirt cheap to shoot a lot and the .308 isn't that far behind, especially with reloading. Both calibers are great and stand on their own merits as far as I'm concerned. For me, if anything gets close enough to know I'm even shooting at it.....it must be my time to go.

It's very interesting to me to read the different perspectives. Awesome thread.

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Old 12-10-2010, 10:37 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Ronbo View Post
I have both .223 and .308, but for different reasons. First is familiarity. I am former military, so these calibers ring a bell, so to speak. The second reason is i want to hunt for food, in varying animal sizes and at varying ranges. Third, i like accurate rifles and these two calibers are widely available in modern firearms with great accuracy out of the box...see other thread.

Finally, and most importantly, when my son returns from Kuwait next year we can do the shooting sports together with our rifles that share both a common heritage and that "ring a bell" for both of us. It's no secret that Military members often buy civilian equivalents of their favorite guns. In my case, exact rifle copies aren't important but the calibers and their ballistics are. For my son, a duplicate is important.

SHTF was not even a consideration in my choice of calibers, or shotgun...which is the same 12 ga Ithaca model 37 i had as a kid back in western New York (south of Buffalo in the potato country)...with some slight modification. My only personal .22 is my old Remington model 581 from the same era. I do have a couple of modern synthetic stock rifles for other things, like training my wife, etc.

Cost and local availability of ammo was considered, but not much, aside from the coincidence that the .223 is dirt cheap to shoot a lot and the .308 isn't that far behind, especially with reloading. Both calibers are great and stand on their own merits as far as I'm concerned. For me, if anything gets close enough to know I'm even shooting at it.....it must be my time to go.

It's very interesting to me to read the different perspectives. Awesome thread.
Man, if I tried to use a gun to train my wife she would kill me in my sleep.
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Old 12-10-2010, 10:40 PM   #16
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Caliber popularity cuts both ways. In the event of "emergency" the supply might get depleted fast but there will still be a lot more of it out there than "exotic" calibers. In SHTF scenario, what do you think are the chances of you finding someone willing to sell, part or barter some .270, .308 or .30-06 vs. .338 Lapua or .300 RUM ammo?

Popular calibers also tend to be cheaper due to mass production so you can afford to stock more now.

That is my thinking/reasoning for choosing .308 anyway.
OK, how much was the last box of .308 you bought. I just picked up 2 boxes of Prvi 196gr 8x57. I need more brass, and since the price was VG I bought.
$12.95 each. That works out almost cheaper then I can reload for.
As far as sell, barter with someone that needs ammo. If it were a friend, I would give it to them, and a rifle if they needed it. If it were a like minded person, I'd do the same. As people, we would still have to work together, that is the key to survival. I still keep a good stash of .22lr subsonics, no noise.
.22 is very light, and pretty darn effective at 50 yards.
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Old 12-10-2010, 10:58 PM   #17
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Check Cabela's for herter's ammo (tula in a yellow box). Tula .308 ammo is running about $8-9 per box of 20 if you buy online in quantity from various places, and some have cases of 500 or 1000 for decent price/round. .223 is in the $4-5 range at wal Mart for boxes of 20 55 gr fmj tula ammo. Cabela's has both calibers in bulk with ammo boxes in those larger quantities. Our Wal Mart has Federal maroon box for $13/box. Not terrible for .308.

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Old 12-10-2010, 11:15 PM   #18
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Check Cabela's for herter's ammo (tula in a yellow box). Tula .308 ammo is running about $8-9 per box of 20 if you buy online in quantity from various places, and some have cases of 500 or 1000 for decent price/round. .223 is in the $4-5 range at wal Mart for boxes of 20 55 gr fmj tula ammo. Cabela's has both calibers in bulk with ammo boxes in those larger quantities. Our Wal Mart has Federal maroon box for $13/box. Not terrible for .308.
It is also steel cased junk. Did you read this??
http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f15/tulammo-35281/

I have some older Steel cased .223 Russian ammo, factory 60 stamped that I bought when Clinton was elected. Since I still have it, you can draw your own conclusion. I have plenty of 7.62x51.
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Old 12-10-2010, 11:17 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Ronbo View Post
Check Cabela's for herter's ammo (tula in a yellow box). Tula .308 ammo is running about $8-9 per box of 20 if you buy online in quantity from various places, and some have cases of 500 or 1000 for decent price/round. .223 is in the $4-5 range at wal Mart for boxes of 20 55 gr fmj tula ammo. Cabela's has both calibers in bulk with ammo boxes in those larger quantities. Our Wal Mart has Federal maroon box for $13/box. Not terrible for .308.
Ammoman has the German DAG 7.62x51 for around that price delivered. Good, high quality NATO ammo.
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Old 12-11-2010, 01:03 AM   #20
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OK, how much was the last box of .308 you bought. I just picked up 2 boxes of Prvi 196gr 8x57. I need more brass, and since the price was VG I bought.
$12.95 each. That works out almost cheaper then I can reload for.
As far as sell, barter with someone that needs ammo. If it were a friend, I would give it to them, and a rifle if they needed it. If it were a like minded person, I'd do the same. As people, we would still have to work together, that is the key to survival. I still keep a good stash of .22lr subsonics, no noise.
.22 is very light, and pretty darn effective at 50 yards.
3 RADWAY GREEN .308 N/C 160RDS/CAN $69.00 $207.00

So that is $207.00 for 480 rounds in 3 ammo cans. I don't reload (yet) but these seems like descent deal to me.

I think people are getting lost from the original question of the OP....which is the reason for choosing a popular caliber than the more obscure ones (if I understood him correctly). The obscure ones are harder to find now and I believe would even more so when the SHTF. Again JMHO.
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