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Old 03-30-2011, 12:39 PM   #21
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I'm the nostalgic type as well, I suppose. At 45, I have spent the vast majority of my adult life in the Army Reserve or the National Guard, where my options were the M16/M4 or M9. I have no issues with any of them (except maybe the GM Hydromatic A2 variants that never seemed to function).

As for me, though, there is just something about a lever action with a wooden stock, or an O/u or SxS shotgun with fine walnut that makes me smile. I just can't say I have ever seen a polymer firearm that had developed, for lack of a better word, character as it aged.

I started to try to picture walking through the fields hunting pheasant with something polymer stocked and forearmed, but then thought better of it. Far too many pleasant memories of me and my father-in-law hunting for that.

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Old 03-30-2011, 03:41 PM   #22
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So many synthetic stocks,multi colored,thumb holed. Pistols and revolvers multi toned made from materials used in the aerospace industries.
All of those sound like form is following function.

Synthetic materials are lighter, more weather-resistant in the long term, or can be made stronger for the same or still less weight as wood.

The multi-tone is often simply the result of using two different materials, and not bothering coating them to match (which would be almost the definition of form following function). Sometimes a carbine steel frame is used with a Titanium cylinder on revolvers. Sometimes a polymer frame is used with a stainless slide. Things like that in which each part is made of a material that best suits its needs, and both are left to their natural finishes or only finished as necessary.

And I wouldn't complain about materials used on spaceships and fighter planes used in my guns. Better than saying "top quality materials used by Martha Stewart in her kitchen!"


Now, don't get me wrong I love a niced blued, all metal gun as much as anyone (well, things like 1911s, PT92s, etc), but I'll give credit where it is due. Though, I'll happily admit I can't stand wood on guns, heh.
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Old 03-30-2011, 06:18 PM   #23
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I'm old fashioned as well in that I prefer the feel of a nice wood stock on a rifle (not to mention the look) and a nice heavy metal frame in my handguns. I know today's manufacturing process is excellent in most mainstream gun manufactures, and that the light alloys and polymers are significant improvements in weight without sacraficing durability for the most part, but as i don't have to carry a gun for a living, the weight factor is not overly significant for me at this time, so I will always gravitate to the "quality feel" that is- at least for me - represented by the combination of wood and steel

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Old 03-30-2011, 06:31 PM   #24
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I'm the nostalgic type as well, I suppose. At 45, I have spent the vast majority of my adult life in the Army Reserve or the National Guard, where my options were the M16/M4 or M9. I have no issues with any of them (except maybe the GM Hydromatic A2 variants that never seemed to function).

As for me, though, there is just something about a lever action with a wooden stock, or an O/u or SxS shotgun with fine walnut that makes me smile. I just can't say I have ever seen a polymer firearm that had developed, for lack of a better word, character as it aged.

I started to try to picture walking through the fields hunting pheasant with something polymer stocked and forearmed, but then thought better of it. Far too many pleasant memories of me and my father-in-law hunting for that.
Thank you for serving our great country. I'm well aware of the risks you certainly have probably taken,the situations you probably were in while serving.My neices DAD was killed in Afghanistan last June,he was also Army National Guard,14 years of service. I'm still angry, everyone loved him so.SFC US Army ROBERT J FIKE, our Hero always.
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Old 03-30-2011, 08:36 PM   #25
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Thank you for serving our great country. I'm well aware of the risks you certainly have probably taken,the situations you probably were in while serving.My neices DAD was killed in Afghanistan last June,he was also Army National Guard,14 years of service. I'm still angry, everyone loved him so.SFC US Army ROBERT J FIKE, our Hero always.
Thank you, and my condolences. I long ago came to the conclusion that when one serves, their family serves along with them. When the ultimate sacrifice is made, that sacrifice is felt most by the loved ones left behind. Pride in their service is only a mild tonic for the heartache left from their passing. When I salute the flag, I often think of those who have served. The next time I salute, I will think of Sergeant First Class Fike.
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Old 03-30-2011, 10:04 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by DocWard View Post
I'm the nostalgic type as well, I suppose. At 45, I have spent the vast majority of my adult life in the Army Reserve or the National Guard, where my options were the M16/M4 or M9. I have no issues with any of them (except maybe the GM Hydromatic A2 variants that never seemed to function).

As for me, though, there is just something about a lever action with a wooden stock, or an O/u or SxS shotgun with fine walnut that makes me smile. I just can't say I have ever seen a polymer firearm that had developed, for lack of a better word, character as it aged.

I started to try to picture walking through the fields hunting pheasant with something polymer stocked and forearmed, but then thought better of it. Far too many pleasant memories of me and my father-in-law hunting for that.
I bought a Charles Daly auto 12ga a number of years ago, it is a synthetic stock, maybe 15. I always seemed to grab my fugly old 500 when I went water fowl hunting. This past year I finally took the Daly. OMG, it was so much fun and the accuracy is outstanding. I do still have my Dads single shot 12ga Winchester, that thing will punish you w/ the extra full choke barrel. I always wanted a SXS for upland birds, but those darn Mausers keep getting in the way. This 500 is original, ever seen one like it??


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Thank you for serving our great country. I'm well aware of the risks you certainly have probably taken,the situations you probably were in while serving.My neices DAD was killed in Afghanistan last June,he was also Army National Guard,14 years of service. I'm still angry, everyone loved him so.SFC US Army ROBERT J FIKE, our Hero always.
I am sorry for your loss. There are no words that can express the sorrow I feel for your family. God bless.
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Old 03-30-2011, 10:12 PM   #27
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I bought a Charles Daly auto 12ga a number of years ago, maybe 15. I always seemed to grab my fugly old 500 when I went water fowl hunting. This past year I finally took the Daly. OMG, it was so much fun and the accuracy is outstanding. I do still have my Dads single shot 12ga Winchester, that thing will punish you w/ the extra full choke barrel. I always wanted a SXS for upland birds, but those darn Mausers keep getting in the way. This 500 is original, ever seen one like it??
Original? No, I don't believe I have! Very unique! The wood looks nice, the camo pattern is something I would have to see in person, but it looks like the sort of thing that would grow on you over time.
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Old 03-30-2011, 10:16 PM   #28
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Well let see Remington when it was sold to Cherbus was tens of millions in the RED. Wonder why that was? Now the new owners have retooled the plants cut cost where they could cut costs. Would you rather they cut the pay of employees that make rifles or would you rather they go from selling a rifle with a $500 stock for $650? That is not making a profit. Sure that H-S stock that cost us $500 cost them $350.

Bottom metal doesn't play a huge part in the accuracy of the rifle. It takes none of the recoil so why are you wasting money on the high quality steel and the many hours to machine it when a cast product will do the same thing?

Do I like my cast bottom metal HELL NO. But I know what they had to do that way. If they didn't make these changes the Remington 700 BDL would cost $2k for a basic hunting rifle. The Winchester new Model 70 would cost you more like $3k.

Everything in the business world is geared toward ONE THING. PROFITS, how much money can I make for my owners, and shareholders.

Why do you think Detroit and the BIG 3 are in trouble? Because they have a much higher overhead than, Toyota, Honda, Hyundia, Kia. They all makes cars right here in the USA using US labor, Hyundia, Kia have some vehicles that are 100% made in the USA. When I looked at the sticker on my AMERICAN car it was made in mexico and Canada and shipped here to the states to be assembled.

Do

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Old 03-31-2011, 03:48 PM   #29
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Why do you think Detroit and the BIG 3 are in trouble? Because they have a much higher overhead than, Toyota, Honda, Hyundia, Kia. They all makes cars right here in the USA using US labor, Hyundia, Kia have some vehicles that are 100% made in the USA. When I looked at the sticker on my AMERICAN car it was made in mexico and Canada and shipped here to the states to be assembled.
I was reading an article last night that said a lot of smaller manufacturers are bringing their factory production back to the states. The reason is a combination of factors, the biggest being poor quality, cost of shipping (fuel), cost of automation is decreasing, and the labor costs overseas have doubled since 2003. Only the largest companies placing the largest orders have the leverage to demand the lowest costs and the highest quality, so the smaller companies are gradually bringing it home. Hopefully that trend will continue.
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Old 03-31-2011, 06:55 PM   #30
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I was reading an article last night that said a lot of smaller manufacturers are bringing their factory production back to the states. The reason is a combination of factors, the biggest being poor quality, cost of shipping (fuel), cost of automation is decreasing, and the labor costs overseas have doubled since 2003. Only the largest companies placing the largest orders have the leverage to demand the lowest costs and the highest quality, so the smaller companies are gradually bringing it home. Hopefully that trend will continue.
Well one of the good things about our hobby is that many of our favorite manufacturers are still making their wares right here in the good ol' US of A.
Here is a neat video of one of my favorites, McMillan stocks. Next time you wonder why they cost what they do replay this video and you'll remember.

Long Gun Journal | Guns & Ammo

Now THAT is top notch American craftsmanship...
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