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-   -   Considering rifle marksmanship: (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f18/considering-rifle-marksmanship-50882/)

Vincine 10-31-2011 12:24 AM

Considering rifle marksmanship:
 
I read the ‘What rifle/caliber’ stickies (Thank you, Dillinger & opaww.) and the short list seems to be Rem’ 700, Win’ 70, Howa 1500, and Savage.

The longest range near me is 300 yds. Google says the nearest 1k yd. range is 6 hours away in PA. That being the case, I’m not seeing any point in getting a rifle that can nail the ‘X’ at 800 - 1,000 yards if I wouldn’t even be able to practice at those ranges. So, considering that limitation, what’s a good common, readily available, domestic, off the shelf, industry standard, tool that will give me the biggest bang for the buck, either used or new? I’m a tall gal (6’ 2.5”) with a 15.5” pull. Are there any that come in an adjustable stock flavor?

.308 seems to be the standard marksmanship caliber at sub 1k yards, but at only 200 - 300 yds. is wind drift even a factor? I’m not going to be shooting in a hurricane. Would I be better off with a lighter caliber until I can max out the capability of the rifle, if ever? I wouldn’t be reloading. Do they even make light weight match calibers?

A police rather than a military rifle?

silverado113 10-31-2011 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincine (Post 615307)
I read the ‘What rifle/caliber’ stickies (Thank you, Dillinger & opaww.) and the short list seems to be Rem’ 700, Win’ 70, Howa 1500, and Savage.

The longest range near me is 300 yds. Google says the nearest 1k yd. range is 6 hours away in PA. That being the case, I’m not seeing any point in getting a rifle that can nail the ‘X’ at 800 - 1,000 yards if I wouldn’t even be able to practice at those ranges. So, considering that limitation, what’s a good common, readily available, domestic, off the shelf, industry standard, tool that will give me the biggest bang for the buck, either used or new? I’m a tall gal (6’ 2.5”) with a 15.5” pull. Are there any that come in an adjustable stock flavor?

.308 seems to be the standard marksmanship caliber at sub 1k yards, but at only 200 - 300 yds. is wind drift even a factor? I’m not going to be shooting in a hurricane. Would I be better off with a lighter caliber until I can max out the capability of the rifle, if ever? I wouldn’t be reloading. Do they even make light weight match calibers?

A police tactical rather than a military sniper rifle?

Wind is a factor at that yardage depending on if it's a full value (left to right) wind or a half value (angled). Check out this document to learn how to account for wind. http://www.ultimatesniper.com/Docs/21.PDF

Vincine 10-31-2011 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverado113 (Post 615316)
Check out this document to learn how to account for wind. http://www.ultimatesniper.com/Docs/21.PDF

Bookmarked, thanks.

>For example, here's the FULL VALUE 10 mph data for a specific round, the .308, 175-grain Match, with a muzzle velocity of 2600 fps:

Distance in Yards & Full Value 10 MPH Drift in Inches
100 200 300 400 500 600 700 800 900 1000
1" 3" 7" 14" 22" 33" 47" 64" 84" 54"

Firing that .308 round, even in a full-value, 30 mph wind requires just 3 inches of right or left compensation at 100 yards.<

762 10-31-2011 12:44 AM

if you're just punching paper at 100-300 yards, just get a .223 or a .243.

Dillinger 10-31-2011 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincine (Post 615307)
So, considering that limitation, what’s a good common, readily available, domestic, off the shelf, industry standard, tool that will give me the biggest bang for the buck, either used or new?

Thanks for the shout out, but I merely contribute here and people comment on it. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincine (Post 615307)
I’m a tall gal (6’ 2.5”) with a 15.5” pull. Are there any that come in an adjustable stock flavor?

Uh. What? What were you saying, I got lost after that first part there... :cool:

Yes. You need an adjustable stock, but the "factory" options are limited I am afraid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincine (Post 615307)
.308 seems to be the standard marksmanship caliber at sub 1k yards, but at only 200 - 300 yds. is wind drift even a factor? I’m not going to be shooting in a hurricane. Would I be better off with a lighter caliber until I can max out the capability of the rifle, if ever? I wouldn’t be reloading. Do they even make light weight match calibers?

A police rather than a military rifle?

The .308 is an industry standard for police and "other" professions inside the magic 600 yard range. It's as "standard" as you can get in 168gr, off the shelf, ready to go ammo.

Federal Gold Metal Match and Black Hills are about as uniform as you can get in factory ammo and both will shoot EXTREMELY well in the right stick. Neither is going to be drastically affected by wind, and it has the power to put down a lot of game (even "other" two legged game) inside of about 650.

Here's the problem I see. You need AT LEAST a customized stock, and if you are going to go that far, you need a glass bed / pillar bed and a tuned trigger, since you are already in there working on the action.

At that point you might want to consider pulling the barrel, truing up / blueprinting the action and perhaps even going for a heavy barrel, custom maker option.

You see where I am going?

It might be easier to "customize" a gun to your shooting skills and needs as opposed to buying off the shelf and trying to make the weapon "fit you".

Hope this info helps!

JD

JTJ 10-31-2011 12:50 AM

I know people that are shooting 223 on AR 15 target platforms at 1000 yds and are competitive. That said there are the 6mm and 6.5mm rounds. The AR 10 type rifles are available in several calibers including 308 and could be fitted with an adjustable stock. For an out of the box bolt action in 308, check out the Savage rifles. Especially the law enforcement series. The 223 and the 308 would probably be the cheapest for ammo for someone that does not hand load. Hornady brought out some steel cased target ammo that is considerably cheaper than brass cased.

Hinermad 10-31-2011 01:03 AM

Vincine, if you're in New York State the assault weapon ban may restrict your use of a collapsible or adjustable stock.

New York defines an assault weapon thus:

Quote:

"Assault weapon" means
(a) a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following characteristics:
(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
(iii) a bayonet mount;
(iv) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor;
(v) a grenade launcher
If you stick with a bolt gun or a rifle with a fixed magazine this doesn't apply, but you should be aware as you make your choice.

Dave

Vincine 10-31-2011 01:36 AM

Look what I just found:

The Howa/Axiom Heavy Barrel Varminter features a rugged lightweight synthetic construction and an instantly adjustable length-of-pull from 11.5 to 15.5 inches. It comes as standard with two recoil suppression devices for improved recoil reduction of up to 70%. It has a completely free-floated barrel that offers maximum accuracy. The model was designed mostly for varmint/predator hunting as well as bench rest shooting.

But it's not domestic, I don't think.

Dillinger 10-31-2011 01:41 AM

HOWA is made in Japan. Weatherby imports their action under the Vanguard line.

If US made is a mandate, you are going to have to go 100% custom. Even companies like Remington are owned by a conglomerate with offices all over the world that share in the profits.

You can always go with something by LaRue. Twice the price, but still US made parts and assembly.

Hit me up if you have questions.

JD

fireguy 10-31-2011 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincine (Post 615391)
Look what I just found:

The Howa/Axiom Heavy Barrel Varminter features a rugged lightweight synthetic construction and an instantly adjustable length-of-pull from 11.5 to 15.5 inches. It comes as standard with two recoil suppression devices for improved recoil reduction of up to 70%. It has a completely free-floated barrel that offers maximum accuracy. The model was designed mostly for varmint/predator hunting as well as bench rest shooting.

But it's not domestic, I don't think.

Vincine,
I have a .308 Axiom Howa. Great rifle. It shoots less than MOA even with me pulling the trigger. You won't go wrong with one of these.


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