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Old 07-10-2008, 02:15 AM   #31
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Your welcome, and glad you enjoyed it, I did! My son is leaving for Iraq in 2 weeks and will probably be deployed to Afghanistan before his tour is over - It's reassuring that we have snipers like the Canadian's there to keep the local insurgents in line. I would give my right nut to be there with a Barret .50 rig...

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Old 07-10-2008, 02:37 AM   #32
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Your welcome, and glad you enjoyed it, I did! My son is leaving for Iraq in 2 weeks and will probably be deployed to Afghanistan before his tour is over - It's reassuring that we have snipers like the Canadian's there to keep the local insurgents in line. I would give my right nut to be there with a Barret .50 rig...

What's your son in? And yes the barret's sure are nice. Kick a bit to much for me still though.
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Old 07-10-2008, 03:44 AM   #33
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A mile shot is 98% shooter and 2% equipment. There are maybe a a hundred shooters in this world that are capable of a shot like that.
Been watching "Lethal Weapon" over and over a few to many times have we ?

"Mel Gibson's line " I did a guy in Laos in high wind at 1,000 yards and only ten guys in the world coulda made that shot" LMAO !!!! Sure Mel and Rosie O'Donut is progun !!! Like theres a special club these guys all get together at and BS about their long range kills .

Please , there's not doubt that it is an extremely rare skill but use some common sense here .

We have the Marines and the Army both with more than one specialized unit within their makeup then we have the SEALS Then we have various Government yet non Military organizations Secrete Service , FBI , CIA not to mention all of the State Police agencies and these just the American organizations we know about . Now lets look at foreign Nations Canada as mentioned then we have English , Israeli , Australian , ETC. ETC. ETC .and these are just the "Good Guys" don't you think the old Soviet block trains men to do the same things how about China ? Here's the real Kicker Kids they been training guys to do this for DECADES !!!!

If you think that only a hundred people out of Billions living in the world can do this you must believe in "Cop Killer Black Talons" Area 51 Alien cover ups , Santa Clause and the Tooth Fairy .

With modern equipment such as range finders , wind gages and now all of the known variables like muzzle velocity Ballistic coefficiency etc. etc. a shot like this is more of a math problem than a shooting skill .

All it takes is an accurate gun a good spotter , quality consistent ammo and a place to sit and play with it , especially when you people will ooh and ah because the shot was made despite allowing for misses with which to adjust by .

These guys shoot at for the most part a stationary target and at the extreme ranges the target will usually never realize he was fired at and given a chance to relocate and become a more difficult target to hit .

Please , it's a rare skill , An admirable skill , unusual even but Please don't try to elevate it to some GOD like skill . Imagine if every single person in the world starting at age 10 were trained in the shooting arts and then long range shooting how many tens of millions would have the same skill .
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Old 07-10-2008, 03:51 AM   #34
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Been watching "Lethal Weapon" over and over a few to many times have we ?

"Mel Gibson's line " I did a guy in Laos in high wind at 1,000 yards and only ten guys in the world coulda made that shot" LMAO !!!! Sure Mel and Rosie O'Donut is progun !!! Like theres a special club these guys all get together at and BS about their long range kills .

Please , there's not doubt that it is an extremely rare skill but use some common sense here .

We have the Marines and the Army both with more than one specialized unit within their makeup then we have the SEALS Then we have various Government yet non Military organizations Secrete Service , FBI , CIA not to mention all of the State Police agencies and these just the American organizations we know about . Now lets look at foreign Nations Canada as mentioned then we have English , Israeli , Australian , ETC. ETC. ETC .and these are just the "Good Guys" don't you think the old Soviet block trains men to do the same things how about China ? Here's the real Kicker Kids they been training guys to do this for DECADES !!!!

If you think that only a hundred people out of Billions living in the world can do this you must believe in "Cop Killer Black Talons" Area 51 Alien cover ups , Santa Clause and the Tooth Fairy .

With modern equipment such as range finders , wind gages and now all of the known variables like muzzle velocity Ballistic coefficiency etc. etc. a shot like this is more of a math problem than a shooting skill .

All it takes is an accurate gun a good spotter , quality consistent ammo and a place to sit and play with it , especially when you people will ooh and ah because the shot was made despite allowing for misses with which to adjust by .

These guys shoot at for the most part a stationary target and at the extreme ranges the target will usually never realize he was fired at and given a chance to relocate and become a more difficult target to hit .

Please , it's a rare skill , An admirable skill , unusual even but Please don't try to elevate it to some GOD like skill . Imagine if every single person in the world starting at age 10 were trained in the shooting arts and then long range shooting how many tens of millions would have the same skill .
sorry but i have to disagree with you here. Maybe he did over elaborate a bit but its still up to the shooter. The rifle has to be an extension of the shooter. You have to feel comfortable with it in order to make a nice clean shot. You can take the most expensive piece of gear throw someone thats shot nothing throw em in mild wind and make them take a mile shot. See if they can make a kill shot on a target? I've been hunting and shooting since i was 8. Im not that proficient at sniping. Sure i can hit a target at a good range. But throw me in a combat situation with no training. See how well i would do.


maybe im wrong though?
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Old 07-10-2008, 05:33 AM   #35
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Been watching "Lethal Weapon" over and over a few to many times have we ?

blah

blah

blah...
How many times have you hit a person sized target at a mile. How many times have you hit a person sized target at 100 yards?

So many factors come into play at distances great than 500 yards that it boils down to shooter. Stuff like trigonometry comes into play. You have to be aware of cross winds and updrafts down range.

Trust me, I know of what I speak.
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Old 07-10-2008, 05:45 AM   #36
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Braeden did you completely miss this in my last post or what ?

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starting at age 10 were trained in the shooting arts and then long range shooting
As far as this statement of yours goes

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Sure i can hit a target at a good range. But throw me in a combat situation with no training. See how well i would do.
I kinda think the whole point to these ultra long range rigs is to reduce the snipers chance of ever being under fire . Don't you ?

I've seen an interview with a couple of snipers , one was a US Marine speaking of some record distance kill and you know never in the entire interview did he ever mention being under fire himself .

The Sniper wars are probably a thing of the past .

You also speak of a "Nice clean Shot" I assume you mean a 1 shot kill , at the extreme ranges that get pushed these days I doubt that happens very often . More than likely the sniper misses with one perhaps two shots and makes adjustments per the information his spotter feeds him . If a sniper is firing at a group already engaged in combat the chances of them even thinking of a sniper is pretty remote leaving him plenty of time to adjust for range and wind drift with his scope .

Think about it , when your comrads are under fire and dying at an extreme range from you what do you have to lose by throwing some lead in that direction and hoping you'll hit an enemy ? No one will know how many rounds you fired but your spotter who also gets a share of the glory so you can get lucky and go talk smack about what a great sniper you are later back at base .
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Old 07-10-2008, 06:10 AM   #37
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I've seen an interview with a couple of snipers , one was a US Marine speaking of some record distance kill and you know never in the entire interview did he ever mention being under fire himself .
So, seeing a couple of interviews is the extent of your experience? That explains everything.
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Old 07-10-2008, 07:06 AM   #38
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LOL matt considering you're all but quoting lines straight out of the movies I wouldn't be slingin around accusations about another's lack of anything .

Hate to burst your Hollywood inspired ego but with all of the agencies I mentioned in my first post and all of the retired "Snipers" there's probably tens of thousands of guys who could make those shots especially when they get to use a highly accurate $5,000 rifle and custom ammo .

The only reason most people can't make such shots is the simple fact that very few ranges offer those kind of distance to shoot at . The Military doesn't let civilians use their ranges as a rule ya know .

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Old 07-10-2008, 07:35 AM   #39
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LOL matt considering you're all but quoting lines straight out of the movies I wouldn't be slingin around accusations about another's lack of anything .

Hate to burst your Hollywood inspired ego but with all of the agencies I mentioned in my first post and all of the retired "Snipers" there's probably tens of thousands of guys who could make those shots especially when they get to use a highly accurate $5,000 rifle and custom ammo .

The only reason most people can't make such shots is the simple fact that very few ranges offer those kind of distance to shoot at . The Military doesn't let civilians use their ranges as a rule ya know .
First, calm down, try to keep things civil.

Second, you don't sound like you have a whole lot of experience in the field of long range shooting. On top of that, your attitude towards the conversation makes me think that you're still a little young.

Third, I've worked closely with ANGLICO teams, Fox/FIST teams, LRS-D teams and Infantry and Cavalry scout teams among others. You'll find a DM or "sniper" associated with all of those teams. I've fired M24s, M21s, M25s, M82/M107s. I've fired those weapons out to 1200m. At those distances things get really tricky even with a good spotter and a shot computer.

DMs and snipers aren't trained to walk shots in. There is a reason that a DM's/sniper's motto is "One shot, one kill," that reason is because they are trained to eliminate a target by using one bullet.

The one shot premise is necessary, because when you've got 2 or 3 guys in the suck, alone with support hours away, that one shot will betray your position, even at distances of a mile plus. If 2 or 3 guys get compromised it's a very bad scene for them.

DMs and snipers are what are known as 'combat multipliers'. They play an important role in anti-materiel operations and in the elimination of key enemy personnel. They go through a lot of training and are usually top notch soldiers before they get selected for the required courses. They simply can't be killed off, or the task force that they support would suffer heavily. Because of this, they can't operate with a 'pray and spray' mentality.
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Old 07-10-2008, 12:13 PM   #40
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What's your son in? And yes the barret's sure are nice. Kick a bit to much for me still though.
He's in the Marines, currently in Ca. at the mock Iraqi village they have there for training. Yes the .50 cal. has an incredible amount of recoil energy throwing out a 750 gr. bullet at those velocities, but the weight of the gun absorbs much of it and the recoil buffer helps tremendously. At $3-5 a rd. it's also a bit expensive to "plink" with!
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