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Old 12-15-2012, 08:52 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by natman View Post
It's entirely possible to take a deer cleanly with a 243. However I prefer a bit more bullet weight and frontal area and am perfectly willing to put up with somewhat more recoil to get it.

Here's a couple of quotes that sum up the 243 pretty well:

Rick Jamison (Shooting Times) has a oft repeated story about a big buck he nailed twice with a 243 that went on to be shot and claimed by other hunters. Page 59 "Rifleman's Handbook":

"I couldn't help feeling that a cartridge with more punch would have anchored the buck sooner."

Jamison is a big fan of the 243 *for varmints*, in fact he considers it the ultimate coyote cartridge.

Finn Aargard (NRA Field Editor)

Aargard wrote an excellent article called "The 243 for Big Game".
Page 101 "Hunting Rifles and Cartridges.

"[If you need a varmint / deer rifle] ..trying to make a varmint cartridge work on big game is going at it the wrong way around. It would be far better to choose a cartridge for the largest game he intended to hunt with it, the develop a load for it that would work on varmints."

"...the 6mms are essentially varmint cartridges. With the right bullets and careful shooting, they can be made to perform fairly satisfactorily on big game up to perhaps 200 lbs liveweight. But why choose a cartridge that is only 'fairly satisfactory' when other cartridges are readily available in rifles that are just as light and have no more kick than those for the 243?"

Emphasis mine. I don't want an adequate cartridge, I want a really good cartridge for any particular game.

Now these are all facts. I appreciate your research. Can't argue with them.
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Old 12-15-2012, 09:45 PM   #42
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Now these are all facts. I appreciate your research. Can't argue with them.
cottontop
You keep insinuating that I don't think a 243 will kill a deer. I have no idea where you got that. I said it was a 'marginal deer caliber' which it is. I have killed deer with a 243 and used one as a snipers rifle (great anti personal round)! If you want a quote from a well known gun writer I will oblige.
This is a quote from the Jan/Feb RifleShooter magazine. The author is Craig Boddington titled 'Playing the Angles'. He is discussing the quarting and up/down angle shots on game. On page 28 he says, and I quote:
"This article doesn't intend to advocate heavier calibers but the reality is your caliber, cartridge and bullet do have input in the 'shoot/don't shoot' decision. On deer size game there are shots you can take with a .30 caliber that you shouldn't take with a .243".
This is true because the .243 is a marginal caliber for deer. I guess there are some 'professional' writers who have the experience and scientific knowledge to make that point other than I!
If a person is looking for a 'first' gun for a young/small hunter I would advise them to go with a 7-08 or a 260 Rem. There in very little difference on the recoil end but a BIG difference on the 'business end' when compared to a 243!
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Old 12-15-2012, 10:01 PM   #43
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but of course!

every cartridge has it's weakness' and strengths. a person needs to learn these and work within those limitations.
If that is the only choice you have and you 'MUST' use it then do so. BUT if you have a choice to use a better tool for the job, by all means do so (for the deers sake).
Just common sense!
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Old 12-15-2012, 10:43 PM   #44
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You keep insinuating that I don't think a 243 will kill a deer. I have no idea where you got that. I said it was a 'marginal deer caliber' which it is. I have killed deer with a 243 and used one as a snipers rifle (great anti personal round)! If you want a quote from a well known gun writer I will oblige.
This is a quote from the Jan/Feb RifleShooter magazine. The author is Craig Boddington titled 'Playing the Angles'. He is discussing the quarting and up/down angle shots on game. On page 28 he says, and I quote:
"This article doesn't intend to advocate heavier calibers but the reality is your caliber, cartridge and bullet do have input in the 'shoot/don't shoot' decision. On deer size game there are shots you can take with a .30 caliber that you shouldn't take with a .243".
This is true because the .243 is a marginal caliber for deer. I guess there are some 'professional' writers who have the experience and scientific knowledge to make that point other than I!
If a person is looking for a 'first' gun for a young/small hunter I would advise them to go with a 7-08 or a 260 Rem. There in very little difference on the recoil end but a BIG difference on the 'business end' when compared to a 243!

This is a good try, and finally some quoted data, but, Mr. Boddington never wrote that the .243 is "marginal." In this situation, just wait a minute or two until the deer turns to offer a slightly improved angle. This would be enough for the .243 bullet to do it's job. So you see, the .243 is not marginal, and I'm sure Mr. Boddington would agree with me. I never insinuated that you thought that the .243 would not kill a deer. I simply restated that you keep stressing that the .243 is "marginal" for deer. I don't know where you got that. You are putting words into places where they don't exist. So, one quote from one gun writer's opinion is all you got? Not enough my friend. Still opinion. No facts. I rest my case, and I am done. It is obvious that you are really fishing now and we are all tired of reading it and watching you embarrass yourself. Give it up.
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Old 12-16-2012, 05:19 AM   #45
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Ive seen hundreds of deer killed with a .243. Its not marginal its a deer killer. Maybe some of you guys' hero's pulled a shot and blamed the caliber,I dont know. With 100gr ammo I have never had to hunt for a deer after it was shot. Hell, Ive killed deer with .223 loaded with 65gr. Gamekings. Might have to walk a little further but still recovered the deer. The shooting range is your friend..

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Old 12-16-2012, 11:00 PM   #46
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I've seem so many carloads of B.S. shoveled out by gun-rag writers that they would be the very last people that would have any credibility with me.

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Old 12-18-2012, 03:49 AM   #47
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Like I said, I post here not to change the mind of those who refuse to face reality, but for those who are interested in facts and information when it comes time to make a decision when it comes to choosing the RIGHT tool for the job. If I prevent even one person from taking the 223 or 243 in the field to hunt deer I have accomplished my mission.
Both of those rounds are good varmint cartridges which, if necessary, can take a deer if you are willing to wait for a PERFICT shot. Just marginal for deer. Like I said I sure hate to confuse this issue with facts, sorry about that!

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Old 12-18-2012, 04:30 AM   #48
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Why is it that people regulary kill deer with 357 magnum handguns which don't amount to pimple on a 243's a$$ but somehow a 243 just isn't enough. The cowboys and indians were killing much larger animals with sticks and 45 colts. Why does everybody think they need an elephant rifle on this continent?

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Old 12-18-2012, 04:32 AM   #49
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Why is it that people regulary kill deer with 357 magnum handguns which don't amount to pimple on a 243's a$$ but somehow a 243 just isn't enough. The cowboys and indians were killing much larger animals with sticks and 45 colts. Why does everybody think they need an elephant rifle on this continent?
It only seems like jim thinks that rd.
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:05 AM   #50
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Like I said, I post here not to change the mind of those who refuse to face reality, but for those who are interested in facts and information when it comes time to make a decision when it comes to choosing the RIGHT tool for the job. If I prevent even one person from taking the 223 or 243 in the field to hunt deer I have accomplished my mission.
Both of those rounds are good varmint cartridges which, if necessary, can take a deer if you are willing to wait for a PERFICT shot. Just marginal for deer. Like I said I sure hate to confuse this issue with facts, sorry about that!
Im not an Elk hunter being from Bama but I wouldnt hesitate to use a .243. Thinking a .243 is a marginal deer round is silly. A .223 might be marginal but Ive done it. Killed them just as dead as your 300 win mag or whatever bloated caliber you use. Your facts are a little off pal.
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