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Old 03-04-2014, 09:55 PM   #11
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For what you can get for an H&K in excellent shape, you could sell it and buy a very decent AR-15. Just sayin'.
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Old 03-05-2014, 03:12 AM   #12
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Sell it, and don't look back. HK is not going anywhere, and will be there next time you want "something else"
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Old 08-11-2016, 04:34 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eatmydust View Post
For what you can get for an H&K in excellent shape, you could sell it and buy a very decent AR-15. Just sayin'.
.223 ammo will be too expensive for him to shoot too. To the OP the .40 is a $1.00 or $1.25 per 50 more expensive than the 9mm to justify loosing money in an excellent gun you have in the USP, the .40 is my most used round BTW, I was going to add I don't trust the 9mm for SD, but don't want to start a war. LOL
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Old 08-11-2016, 10:37 PM   #14
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If you don't already own the following items, sell your HK pistol and obtain these:

1. weapon light and handheld flashlight
2. holster that accommodates a pistol with a weapon light
3. night sights
4. spare magazines (I prefer to have 5 or 6 per firearm)
5. spare parts (firing pin, springs, screws for the front sight, trigger and locking block pins, armorer's tool)
6. If you still have money left, buy ammo

All pistols should be reliable and durable, and my Glock has never given me any problems, but some having spare parts and magazines means your pistol won't become an overpriced paper weight if no gunsmith is available to fix whatever happens to break.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:30 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by ca1survivor View Post
.223 ammo will be too expensive for him to shoot too. To the OP the .40 is a $1.00 or $1.25 per 50 more expensive than the 9mm to justify loosing money in an excellent gun you have in the USP, the .40 is my most used round BTW, I was going to add I don't trust the 9mm for SD, but don't want to start a war. LOL
i know this is an older thread, but just read this comment.

why not the 9mm for self defense?

care to clarify your reasoning?

especially when ballistics testing show almost identical performance between most cartridges used for self defense.

i am really curious as to what you base your opinion of such off of. are you privy to information the rest of us aren't?
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Old 08-12-2016, 01:14 PM   #16
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yes, I don't trust the 9mm for SD, is my personal choice, a 9mm might expand in
ballistic testing, which I consider BS but a .40 or .45 won't shrink plus the .40s and .45s have heavier bullet, you choose as you like.
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Old 08-12-2016, 03:58 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by ca1survivor View Post
yes, I don't trust the 9mm for SD, is my personal choice, a 9mm might expand in
ballistic testing, which I consider BS but a .40 or .45 won't shrink plus the .40s and .45s have heavier bullet, you choose as you like.
you might want to study ballistics and human anatomy for starters. also know that bullet and ammunition manufacturers spend a lot of money on research and development of bullet construction for them to perform in satisfactory manner.

there is no "might" expand in ballistic testing. they have been pulled from human and animal bodies to know they expand. it's not BS, it's fact. Google 9mm self defense bullets on the internet for pictures.

there are only two ways a bullet can instantly stop a man. either by rapid and massive blood loss, or a hit to the central nervous system. and thinking a 40 or a 45 are a guarantee over that of a 9mm is purely delusional on your part. but go ahead and believe whatever makes you happy.
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Old 08-12-2016, 09:04 PM   #18
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Denim, thick clothing, sheet metal, and numerous other materials have been known to stop up a hp. With a .45 it will never shrink down to 9mm and if a 9mm doesn't expand it will most likely go straight through the perp. Where a .45 will also most likely go straight through but it will transfer more energy to the target and create a bigger wound channel ie more chances of hitting a vital and more blood loss.
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Old 08-12-2016, 10:20 PM   #19
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Denim, thick clothing, sheet metal, and numerous other materials have been known to stop up a hp. With a .45 it will never shrink down to 9mm and if a 9mm doesn't expand it will most likely go straight through the perp. Where a .45 will also most likely go straight through but it will transfer more energy to the target and create a bigger wound channel ie more chances of hitting a vital and more blood loss.
again, study up on ballistics and human anatomy.

there is not that huge a difference in the diameters between a 9mm vs. a 40 caliber or a 45 caliber. take out a pair of dial calipers and measure them. .045" between a 9mm and a 40 caliber. and .096" between a 9mm and a 45 caliber. measure those differences with a dial caliper. it will pretty much destroy your misconceptions about bigger is always better.

and i have studied the difference between them on various materials. i know what they will do. there isn't as big a difference as you are thinking there is.

you know what makes the difference? shot placement! how do you get good shot placement? you practice?

i have no idea as to where you two are getting your information, but it's pure BS.

and BTW, i own all of these calibers, so i'm not invested with one caliber over another. i have learned to shoot whatever pistol i have, regardless of the caliber, and am not going to rely upon some myth that a bigger bullet is better. IOW's, i practice shooting and base my opinions on what i have seen.
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Old 08-12-2016, 11:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallas53 View Post
again, study up on ballistics and human anatomy.

there is not that huge a difference in the diameters between a 9mm vs. a 40 caliber or a 45 caliber. take out a pair of dial calipers and measure them. .045" between a 9mm and a 40 caliber. and .096" between a 9mm and a 45 caliber. measure those differences with a dial caliper. it will pretty much destroy your misconceptions about bigger is always better.

and i have studied the difference between them on various materials. i know what they will do. there isn't as big a difference as you are thinking there is.

you know what makes the difference? shot placement! how do you get good shot placement? you practice?

i have no idea as to where you two are getting your information, but it's pure BS.

and BTW, i own all of these calibers, so i'm not invested with one caliber over another. i have learned to shoot whatever pistol i have, regardless of the caliber, and am not going to rely upon some myth that a bigger bullet is better. IOW's, i practice shooting and base my opinions on what i have seen.
Then add that human tissue is largely elastic. I've seen gunshot wounds on humans from 9mm, .38, .22, .25, .45. without recovering the projectiles or the victims of the .45 shots knowing what diameter they shot themselves with, (Yes, two of the three .45 wound recipients were form self inflicted NDs.), the diameter would have been unknown on the 9mm, .38 and .45. Similarly the victims from the .25 and .22 also had no discernible difference in the actual wound diameters.

One of the patient's shot with a .38 was the worst off but he caught 5 out of 6 rounds fired at him. One nicked his femoral artery, and two others hit his liver, on more was superficial in the thigh, and the last one went through his hand and forearm. The other .38 victim was hit in the buttocks.

The two self inflicted .45 hits were both received in almost the exact same way. Both were preparing to clean their 1911's, dropped the mag pointed the pistol downward while sitting to rack the slide and pulled the trigger while getting ready to push the slide back. both were hit in the lower leg. both managed to thread the bullet between the tibia and the fibula. Both walked to the phone and called ambulances. One shot himself with a FMJ the other with a Golden Saber. Neither projectile was present when they arrived at the clinic. Both looked like someone shoved a pencil through their leg. Neither suffered any permanent disability and were both back to full duty after 4 weeks. these were two years apart from each other but both were so freakishly similar that they are burned into my memory.

The other victim of a .45 hit was struck in the abdomen, but the vena cava, ascending aorta, kidneys, and liver were all missed. Some bowel resection and the patient recovered.

The 9mm victim was hit twice. Once in the pelvic girdle with the bullet entering the iliac crest of the right hip, traversing across the width of the pelvic girdle and embedded in the femoral head of the left femur. The other round entered the right side near the lower portion of the rib cage, hit his liver, then the descending aorta and left kidney. Patient did not survive.


The .25 victim took two hits. One to the upper chest and one to the left shoulder. Only one bullet was recovered, the other passed through. The subclavian nerve was damaged, and the patient had some permanent numbness in his left arm.

The .22 victim was hit 4 times in the posterior of the neck He ended up with some nerve damage but the major arteries and spine were missed.

Do I think the 9mm is magical because it is the only one that killed any of the gunshot victims I've seen? Nope. It all is well explained by the anatomical structures that were hit or missed in each case. A .40 or .45 striking the same structures would have likely caused the same end result. Just like a 9mm threading past the same structures that the .45 rounds missed would have likely had a similar result.

I tend to be concerned more about adequate penetration. Seeing that bullet can go the distance to reach vital organs or blood vessels from odd angles and with bone interference gives me better confidence. Also knowing that I can get more accurate and faster follow ups in less time makes me feel better than 1/100th of an inch in diameter.
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