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Old 03-17-2010, 05:13 AM   #21
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In Washington state, we have the Good Samaritan law, which covers you if you try to "render aid," but make a mess of things. And, God only knows how in such a liberal state, IF your shooting is considered justified, you are also immune to civil prosecution.

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Old 03-18-2010, 07:39 PM   #22
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To add my $.02 worth. Even in Texas a Peace officer is not REQUIRED to intervene. I would teach officers to only intervene in an off duty situation IF they have no alternative and their intervention is not likely to make matters worse.

Even for officers, it sometimes better to be a good, living witness.

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Old 03-19-2010, 07:25 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by collegekid20 View Post
I'm not a lawyer so don't take this as legal advice. Laws differ from state to state and city to city. I am a law student in Virginia and mainly study va laws in my spare time as they apply to me. C3 shooter is exactly correct. In Virginia you CANNOT shoot a person unless they have a deadly weopon, and are putting YOU in IMMEDIATE danger. If someone puts a gun to someone elses head and I then shoot them, I could go to jail. It rarely happens and no jury in the world would convict you for it, I'm just stating what the law here states. now if it were me and I thought my life was in danger, I might take the shot. It really depends. As you stated it, if you take the shot, you could be facing criminal charges, being sued by the criminals family, or if you hit a bystander, be sued by their family. Best thing to do is let the police handle it, be a good witness and get a description of the bad guys, height, weight, tattoos, etc. Scenarios like this rarely happen, I'd look up your local and state laws. I tend to err on the side of safety but it's up to you. Carrying a gun is a great responsibility and liberals will look for any reason to infringe on our rights as citizens. Just be careful and shoot safe.
If find it strange that VA wouldn't permit one to take a shot, if a perp had a gun to the head of another innocent person. Would you mind posting a link or posting the verbiage in the VA law that would prohibit a citizen from using lethal force, in order to protect the life of another innocent person?
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Old 03-19-2010, 08:29 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Mutabam View Post
If find it strange that VA wouldn't permit one to take a shot, if a perp had a gun to the head of another innocent person. Would you mind posting a link or posting the verbiage in the VA law that would prohibit a citizen from using lethal force, in order to protect the life of another innocent person?
I find that strange also. Most states laws on self defense are usually written so that you can defend your life, or the life of any other innocent person, with whatever force is necessary, up to and including deadly force. I find it odd that Virginia would say you can't come to someone else's aid with deadly force, if that was what was needed to save their life.
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Old 03-19-2010, 08:37 PM   #25
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Mutabam- here is your first law lesson- and it's free. ( I charge for others )

It is not what the LAW itself says- it may be what the law does NOT say- and it is CASE law- how the law has been interpreted by a judge in some past case.

To use non-firearm examples-

Life-safety code- "A firedoor may be held open by a mechanical device that is controlled by a smoke detector placed on either side of the door opening." Pretty straight forward. Now, let split legal hairs- As just used, did the code INTEND that a smoke detector be placed on both sides of the door opening, or on one side OR the other?

Motor vehicle safety inspection code- A motor vehicle must be equipped with a working parking brake. Well, that's reasonable. Uhhhh- about my Harley Fat Boy.....and my Harley also does not meet the windshield wiper requirement......

Now, here is some of the case law on firearms. Please note that justifiable homicide is an affirmative defense. What you are doing is showing that what you were charged with did not contain at least one of the elements of murder. http://www.vcdl.org/pdf/Virginia-self-defense-cases.pdf

Just remember the old Mexican curse- it will be true anytime you are involved in a shooting. It is "May your life be filled with lawyers."

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Old 03-19-2010, 10:15 PM   #26
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When I took the class for my Colorado CCW I was amazed at what is considered self defense. A criminal defence attorney was one of the instructors. That class was worth 10 times what I paid for it. Anyway, in Colorado if you stumble onto an armed robery you have the right to stop it by shooting the robber. It is considered self defense even if you were not in danger. Same thing with an assault on a person. I was also supprised to find that if you see someone comitting arson of an inhabited building and you shoot them that too is considered self defense or defense of another.

They are trying to pass a bill that would allow an employee, any employee of a business to use deadly force to stop a crime. They would have the right to use any weapon that their were able to aquire. This sounds like a tough one though. What about a company that has a no guns allowed by employees policy. I would think that if this bill were to pass, the next step would be to stop those types of rules by employers.

We have that policy at my hotel. I did not write it. But, I am forced to follow it. Several of us have permits. But we are still not allowed to carry at work. It worrys me because there have been several murders and attempted murders in hotels in my area lately. The Burger King next door to my hotel was robbed at knife point. A few years back a man held a knife to the throat of one of my maids and attemped to rape her. She escaped unharmed. But emotionally, she will never be the same. And my hotel is one the nice part of town.

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Old 03-20-2010, 01:52 AM   #27
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I'm on my second Texas CHL and had to get straight with this issue up front. The CHL does not make me a police officer and I will do everything in my power to remove myself from a shooting situation. Then, when all else fails and I am in dire peril, I will shoot. If I do anything else, I could be charged or sued.

Your CHL allows you to carry a loaded firearm concealed. That's all. It gives you no more power or responsibility to do anything EXCEPT that you are responsible for any round that you discharge and you will pay for anything that round harms either financially or criminally.

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