Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Handguns > Concealed Carrying & Personal Protection > Still a youngin... Any ideas on concealed handguns?

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Old 05-22-2013, 09:27 PM   #61
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I'm all for 1 in the chamber, but the video is crap. In the 1st attack she has her hand on the gun and is ready for the attack before it happens. She is also further away at the outset. In the 2nd attack, she has her hand off he gun, she is caught unaware, and he is closer. He also goes for the gun (he knows she has to rack the slide and is purposefully blocking her).

It's not apples to apples, it's just made to look that way to prove their point.

Regardless, I still agree with the point they are making.

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Old 05-22-2013, 09:44 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by knfxda
I'm all for 1 in the chamber, but the video is crap. In the 1st attack she has her hand on the gun and is ready for the attack before it happens. She is also further away at the outset. In the 2nd attack, she has her hand off he gun, she is caught unaware, and he is closer. He also goes for the gun (he knows she has to rack the slide and is purposefully blocking her).

It's not apples to apples, it's just made to look that way to prove their point.

Regardless, I still agree with the point they are making.
I agree that the first video is not the best example, but it's still a good example nonetheless. Whether or not it's an unbiased, scientific study is irrelevant. The point it was trying to make was having a round chambered removes one les step between drawing and firing.

I hate when people try to say "I'll have enough time because I'll see it coming" or "That's how the IDF does it" or "I've practiced a lot with drawing and chambering."

What they fail to realize is that during those crucial moments of self defense, the support hand may be needed to shove, strike, deflect a barrel pointed at your grape, etc. Worse yet, what if the support hand becomes incapacitated in a struggle?
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:47 PM   #63
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Thats not the video I was referencing. I can't find the one I am thinking of for the life of me so I will just explain it.

The video I saw goes like this:
A customer is concealed carrying in a jewelry store. Two bad guy rush and brush right past the customer. They stop just in front of the customer and shove their guns in the face of the owner. Meanwhile, the customer pulls out his gun but oh wait, he doesn't have one in the chamber. He tries to rack the slide but with everything that is going on he can't seem to hold onto the slide and pull it all the way back. Well the bad guys quickly catch on to what is going on and turn on the customer. The customer thinks several times that he has racked the slide all the way back in order to load the gun and keeps pointing it at the bad guys and pulling the trigger but still he has failed to get a round in the chamber. The bad guys shoot the customer numerous times. Once the customer goes down, they storm him, beat and kick him several times including in the head, and then steal his gun. In the end, the customer reportedly died.

I know this is just one story, but the video was pretty gruesome and shows just why you have to be ready to react to a situation, and that includes your gun being ready.

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Old 05-22-2013, 09:54 PM   #64
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Well then how bout this one, just for $h!ts and giggles...


http://youtu.be/jmKR6evZRQQ

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Old 05-22-2013, 10:31 PM   #65
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I have been shooting/hunting for 23 years. Started with a .410 and a .22 and went from there. About 4 months ago...I purchased my first handgun....and shortly after...my second. The latter was a .22 SA revolver. Getting back into shooting has taught me the value of a .22 for mechanics, fun. I hold the single action revolver the same way that I holds my .40...and Mt accuracy had improved greatly with a handgun in the last couple months...almost 3 times as many round s through the .22 than the .40.

Also, someone earlier mentioned "fanboy" in terms of reccomendations. My recconendation comes purely from experience and research of the market. I personally feel that for the value, function, and ease of operation...you cannot beat a, shield. I know this is my opinion...but "fanboy" I am not.
Sorry for hurting you're feelings.
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Old 05-22-2013, 11:22 PM   #66
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Turn old enough for a CCW in 9ish months, and I'd like to get a head start on a decent gun passable for everyday carry. Tips, recommendations, and debates would be greatly appreciated- Thank you
Chose the MOST gun you can shot well and WILL carry. The sky's the limit!
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:32 AM   #67
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Sorry for hurting you're feelings.
no problem sig....did not hurt feelings..just felt it necessary to explain my position..no harm, no foul.
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Old 05-23-2013, 01:23 AM   #68
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Well I'd just like to give my .02 about the .22/higher caliber debate.

I perfectly understand everything you are saying about starting with the .22, in terms of training to become a good shot, affordability, etc. I understand, and completely agree with your reasoning.

On the other hand, he says he already has a full size 9mm. So we know therefore that he can at least handle that much recoil. If he buys a compact or subcompact size 9mm, sure the recoil will be slightly worse, but he will certainly still be able to manage it. It's not like he's starting on a compact sized 40 S&W, which is what I learned on. I'm a pretty normal sized guy, and had only shot a handgun on one occasion before I bought my .40. The first time I shot a handgun was when I took my CCW course, and I rented a Glock 19. I then bought the .40 and now, I consider myself am a proficient shot for a self defense situation. Keeping a col head and getting the sights on the target is more important than being able to make a keyhole with ten rounds at 25 yards. In a self defense situation my opinion is you want your entry holes spread out over a slightly greater area, anyway. This is to ensure maximum bleeding and internal trauma to the body. My point is, you don't need (and shouldn't want) precision accuracy in a self defense situation. Shot placement is important, so long as you're hitting your target.

Yes, I am a Marine, but the Corps hasn't yet trained me on a handgun. They did however make me a highly proficient marksman on a rifle. A lot of the fundamentals transfer over, in my opinion. Including sight picture, breathing control, and (in my opinion the most important) trigger control. He wants to be a Marine, and I'm sure he will become one if his drive is there. That being said, he will become a proficient marksman.

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Um. . . yes, most cops and soldiers are excellent pistol shots. Not.
First of all, I'd like to say there was never any mention of Soldiers. Marines are NOT Soldiers (not that there's anything wrong with being a Soldier). We are Marines, and we are riflemen. Second, while its true not all service members are trained on a handgun, ALL Marines are trained in rifle marksmanship. I've already talked abut that. No need to repeat myself.

I would trust a handgun in the hands of a Marine who doesn't have any training on a handgun any day over most lifetime shooters who spend hours "training." What I mean is most people "train" by going to an indoor range and maybe practice drawing and firing from concealment. Maybe they take a CCW class, which is helpful but honestly its not training.

Good training and muscle memory doesn't come from sending thousands of rounds down range. It comes from applying the fundamentals and concentrating on every, single, shot. If you do it right you can get just as good, if not better, of training from shooting one box a month vice if you shoot hundreds of rounds sloppily.

I also believe with fewer rounds, you should and probably will have more discipline. Which means you will make the most out of every shot. It is easy to get lackadaisical and complacent with hundred of rounds to shoot.

All that being said, I appreciate the value and fun of a .22 handgun. I own one and will buy more. Short of the cost of ammo, I see no advantage to buying a .22 when he already owns a 9mm.

Please don't think I'm trying to belittle anyone's experience or knowledge. There are countless people here who know more than me and are better trained than me. Like I said, I'm just giving my .02 based off my own experience and beliefs.

Sorry this post ended up so long.
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Old 05-23-2013, 03:00 AM   #69
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"Good training and muscle memory doesn't come from sending thousands of rounds down range. It comes from applying the fundamentals and concentrating on every, single, shot. If you do it right you can get just as good, if not better, of training from shooting one box a month vice if you shoot hundreds of rounds sloppily."

But what if you shoot hundreds of rounds with the same concentrartion that you shoot the one box? I am not an advocate of the "spray and pray" school. When starting out, every shot should be deliberate.

I can sure tell the difference in MY shooting when I slack off on my practice.

And, with regard to the not needing percision accuracy in a self defense situation -- yes and no. You might not need to be able to draw and hit an asprin, like Bill Jordan could do, or put five shoots into a playing card in 2/5 of a second like Ed McGivern, but you need to be reasonably accurate. Assuming that factors like stress, fear, etc. will affect your accuracy, the better you are to begin with the better your likely to be when the shinola hits the fan.

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Old 05-23-2013, 03:10 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpossum
But what if you shoot hundreds of rounds with the same concentrartion that you shoot the one box? I am not an advocate of the "spray and pray" school. When starting out, every shot should be deliberate.

I can sure tell the difference in MY shooting when I slack off on my practice.

And, with regard to the not needing percision accuracy in a self defense situation -- yes and no. You might not need to be able to draw and hit an asprin, like Bill Jordan could do, or put five shoots into a playing card in 2/5 of a second like Ed McGivern, but you need to be reasonable accurate. Assuming that factors like stress, fear, etc. will affect you accuracy, the better you are to begin with the better your likely to be when the shinola hits the fan.
Right, I agree 100%. This is why I have a .22 as well as my full caliber handguns. However, given the OP's specific circumstance ($600 limit, gun specifically for CCW, already has a 9mm, etc etc), my opinion is to start with the caliber he wants to use for defensive purposes and maybe later get a .22 when his situation allows. In conjunction with getting his CCW gun first, he must of course learn the fundamentals and apply them to every shot he sends down range.

By the way, we're all assuming he isn't already proficient/trained with a handgun. He says he has a 9mm, maybe his dad taught him how to shoot? Even if it wasn't extensive, I'm sure he remembers the lesson, if that is the case. Just because someone is young and doesn't have his CCW doesn't mean he doesn't know what he's doing.
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