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Old 12-29-2012, 12:25 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Tackleberry1 View Post
NFP17...

Reading your posts...forgive me if I'm wrong...but you sound a bit young?

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you either don't carry, or just recently started, and have never seved in an armed capacity...IE, military or LEO.

FYI...asking a person you don't know if they've shot or killed another human being is extremely bad form for 2 reasons.

1. Those who have do not share the experience with there closest friends...and certainly not with people on the internet.

2. Too many of those who have not...wish to sound like they have...why, I don't know, but Internet commando's are everywhere.

Your question about the number of criminals put down by there intended victims is valid and I would love to see those stats myself. Your question about whether or not Cane has been forced to take a life is NOT valid...and in my humble opinion...quite rude.

Not trying to beat you up or offend you. I just noticed your a new member here and I can guarantee this gentle etiquette lesson will serve you well...if heeded.

Tack
Tack,

I have to admit that I have often disagreed with some of your posts, but you are spot on with this one. I considered responding to NFP17's psot, but I couldn't bring myself to answer it as politely as you did. Very good job, sir. Excellent.
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Old 12-29-2012, 07:17 PM   #62
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Default Great feedback, guys...

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Originally Posted by Doc3402 View Post
Tack,

I have to admit that I have often disagreed with some of your posts, but you are spot on with this one. I considered responding to NFP17's psot, but I couldn't bring myself to answer it as politely as you did. Very good job, sir. Excellent.
Nice to get some feedback, guys. A few counterpoints...

--I'm not young; late 50's, ex-military.

--I never used the words "killed" or "take a life"; I said "shot". I have a friend who fought at Hue in the Tet Offensive. I asked him if he shot guys. He said yes. No big deal.

--One man's rudeness is another man's lullaby. As you said, some guys get off on talking about their Tango tally; apparently Canebrake is not one of them.

--Ted Nugent plays kick-ass guitar and his eponymous band put on one helluva show back in the late 70's. As for his views on firearms...gotta love his energy!
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Old 01-01-2013, 08:33 PM   #63
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I'm not gonna lie to police and fake a heart attack... What the heck? That just makes you look guilty.

If you really think they're out to get you then just remain quiet until a lawyer comes...

My advice is to be uber-polite and completely honest and upfront with them whenever dealing with police in general. Well, unless you're carrying a gun/knife/pepper spray/whatever for self-defense and it's banned... Then I'd probably lie if they asked me if I was carrying weapons. Nobody has the right to tell me I can't defend myself...

And don't do anything stupid when defending yourself so they have nothing to throw at you legally to begin with.

Obviously, you shouldn't say anything stupid that the "liberal" anti-self-defense, pro-criminal douchebag lawyers and judges can use against you. But I guess I have a little more faith in our legal system than I should (which isn't much. I hate our legal system...) Admittedly, I have ZERO experience with it (I've never even gotten a ticket...) But if you were justified in using lethal force, then I think you should be okay.

Although... the witch-hunt of George Zimmerman quickly comes to mind... Not to mention that white store owner who got charged with murder for shooting some black armed robber on the ground after they bursted into his store pointing guns at him... Whites shooting brown people in self-defense in America is always a big no-no these days... "Liberals" across the entire world will pretty much automatically portray you as a "Redneck" neo-Nazi and call for your head...

As to the other advice of putting your phone down and not talking to the people at the scene of the shooting - why...?

Personally, if I felt safe enough to keep the gun aimed on the bad guy while holding the phone to my ear with my other hand, I'd probably take the time to describe what happened, what I looked like, what the bad guy looked like and that I'm still pointing the gun at him while I wait for the police and medical personal to arrive on scene.

And if somebody at the scene asks you what the heck is going on, why not tell them? It would help to prevent panic if they knew you just defended yourself.

But I agree with keeping yourself in shape physically, having the mental fortitude to use lethal force when needed, keeping a very sharp eye on the bad guy even after he's down, not shooting more than necessary (in order to avoid legal trouble. Personally, I'm a fan of vigilantism and using lethal force to prevent crime in general... Even though I'd never do it personally because I don't want to go to jail... But I don't have a moral problem at all with good people standing up to the criminal element of society... All this "Retreat and run away if you can! You NEVER want to take a human life!" crap makes me want to puke... Mmm. I dunno. I can't say I'd be too upset if the local chapter of MS-13 in my area was sent straight to hell...), being very aware of what's going on around you in case some of his depraved buddies are in the area, and asking for medical aid during the 911 call so in the court you look like a good person, etc.

Some of your other advice about pretending to have a medical problem just seems really odd to me, though. How many times have you had to use your firearm in self-defense? Do the police and legal system really try to lynch you for defending yourself?

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Old 01-02-2013, 02:27 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuckers View Post
... Do the police and legal system really try to lynch you for defending yourself?
The short answer to your question is: YES! The police are not your friends, they are not there to find the truth, not there to see justice done, etc.; they are there to clear cases. If you talk to them without a competent lawyer, you will pay the price. Please take a few minutes and watch this video:
It will save you much heartache and trouble if you ever find yourself in a troubling situation.

As to how many gunfights in which one has been involved, well, the more important question is how many has one avoided? Being situationally aware and avoiding a gunfight is so much better than all the problems encountered after being in a gunfight that the goal is clear...don't get into one!
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Old 01-02-2013, 03:38 PM   #65
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Great read. Thank you

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Old 01-02-2013, 04:44 PM   #66
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Yuckers,

I've personally been carrying a concealed hand gun daily for 17 years. It's needed to be disayed twice but never fired...and I consider one of the two "displays" as a monumental failures on my part for being someplace I should not have been.

The decision to carry is not about standing up to BG's. It's about ensuring your personal safety so you can continue to provide for those you are responsible for.

LEO's do NOT see you as some kind of "equal" because you qualified for a CCW permit and there job is to:
1. Not get Dead
2. Hang a charge...and I don't care if there responding to a shooting or a jay walker...there job IS TO hang a charge on someone.

I find Cane's advice to be spot on in every aspect and would leave you with a though taken from an article in American Hangunner many years ago.

"A gun does not make you a cop anymore than a fire extinguisher makes you a fireman...both are tools that MAY allow you to survive a deadly situation UNTIL professional help arrives".

I believe this mindset will serve anyone who wishes to live peacefully, is prepared to act violently, "in self Defence", and keep you out of a cage...should you embrace it.

I'm not trying to tell you how you should think here, just sharing my beliefs base on 6 years of Infantry service and 17 years of daily CCW.

Good luck and be safe.

Tack

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuckers View Post
I'm not gonna lie to police and fake a heart attack... What the heck? That just makes you look guilty.

If you really think they're out to get you then just remain quiet until a lawyer comes...

My advice is to be uber-polite and completely honest and upfront with them whenever dealing with police in general. Well, unless you're carrying a gun/knife/pepper spray/whatever for self-defense and it's banned... Then I'd probably lie if they asked me if I was carrying weapons. Nobody has the right to tell me I can't defend myself...

And don't do anything stupid when defending yourself so they have nothing to throw at you legally to begin with.

Obviously, you shouldn't say anything stupid that the "liberal" anti-self-defense, pro-criminal douchebag lawyers and judges can use against you. But I guess I have a little more faith in our legal system than I should (which isn't much. I hate our legal system...) Admittedly, I have ZERO experience with it (I've never even gotten a ticket...) But if you were justified in using lethal force, then I think you should be okay.

Although... the witch-hunt of George Zimmerman quickly comes to mind... Not to mention that white store owner who got charged with murder for shooting some black armed robber on the ground after they bursted into his store pointing guns at him... Whites shooting brown people in self-defense in America is always a big no-no these days... "Liberals" across the entire world will pretty much automatically portray you as a "Redneck" neo-Nazi and call for your head...

As to the other advice of putting your phone down and not talking to the people at the scene of the shooting - why...?

Personally, if I felt safe enough to keep the gun aimed on the bad guy while holding the phone to my ear with my other hand, I'd probably take the time to describe what happened, what I looked like, what the bad guy looked like and that I'm still pointing the gun at him while I wait for the police and medical personal to arrive on scene.

And if somebody at the scene asks you what the heck is going on, why not tell them? It would help to prevent panic if they knew you just defended yourself.

But I agree with keeping yourself in shape physically, having the mental fortitude to use lethal force when needed, keeping a very sharp eye on the bad guy even after he's down, not shooting more than necessary (in order to avoid legal trouble. Personally, I'm a fan of vigilantism and using lethal force to prevent crime in general... Even though I'd never do it personally because I don't want to go to jail... But I don't have a moral problem at all with good people standing up to the criminal element of society... All this "Retreat and run away if you can! You NEVER want to take a human life!" crap makes me want to puke... Mmm. I dunno. I can't say I'd be too upset if the local chapter of MS-13 in my area was sent straight to hell...), being very aware of what's going on around you in case some of his depraved buddies are in the area, and asking for medical aid during the 911 call so in the court you look like a good person, etc.

Some of your other advice about pretending to have a medical problem just seems really odd to me, though. How many times have you had to use your firearm in self-defense? Do the police and legal system really try to lynch you for defending yourself?
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:15 PM   #67
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thank you very much, Cane. I hope I never need this advice, but I need to know it NOW.

again, thanks.

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Old 01-06-2013, 10:25 PM   #68
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Just remember that anything you CAN and WILL be used against you in a court of law. On the other hand, it can't be used to help you.

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Old 01-08-2013, 10:59 AM   #69
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As a newbie, I appreciate the well thought out, reasoned opinions voiced on most of the forums here at firearmstalk.com. There are very few idiots (always expecting a few, and hearing from them) and for the most part, they are handled couteously by the majority of mature adults here. Thank you for the collective wisdom shared here. We never know how we effect others, but the sharing of knowledge and wisdom can only improve this world for all of us.

Thank you.

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Old 01-18-2013, 03:39 AM   #70
I want either less corruption or more opportunity to participate in it.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by primer1 View Post
While this zombie thread is awake, what is the best way to pick an attorney? I looked through the local yellow pages and there is around thirty pages of attorneys. What questions do I ask, besides having experience with defending someone involved in a shooting.
(chorus)
Whether you're a brother
or whether you're a mother
you're stayin' alive, stayin' alive
Feel the city breakin
and everybody shakin'
and were stayin' alive, stayin' alive
Ah, ha, ha, ha, stayin' alive, stayin' alive
Ah, ha, ha, ha, stayin' alive


Sorry - couldn't help myself.

Check out http://www.armedcitizensnetwork.org/

I don't have personal experience with them, but have heard several great references to them.
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