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Old 09-11-2009, 10:31 AM   #1
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Default Frangible Bullets a choice for Home Defense?

I mention Frangible Bullets and Home Defense in the title of this forum thread. When I mention Home, I'm mostly mentioning an apartment.

As for Frangible Bullets, does anyone have an opinion on these as a home defense choice?

What I mean to say is that I assume Frangible Bullets give confidence that maybe it won't go through a wall into your neighbor, but are Frangible bullets a good stopping round as well? I have a 9mm pistol as one of my home defense guns. My .40 caliber is for concealed carry.

Let me know what you guys think.

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Old 09-11-2009, 11:41 AM   #2
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Frankly, MOST frangibles would not be my first choice- two reasons- very LIGHT bullets (typical 9mm Luger is 100 grains) and very limited penetration. Rounds like the Glaser are considered frangibles, but most are intended for training, steel plate matches, etc. And two layers of drywall are not going to stop a 9mm, frangible or ball.

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Old 09-11-2009, 01:09 PM   #3
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C3 is correct on what he stated. Frangibles are becoming popular at ranges due to the lead problems. As far a home defense round, I am gonna say it will depend on your choice of firearm or shotty. In this case, bigger may be better. The ballistics can almost be the same and your firearm shoots cooler and cleaner than traditional projectiles with increased velocities at reduced pressures. That being said, it would penetrate Sheetrock, if you miss your target and they do make hollow points. Either way, for range or home defense bullet, I would not want to be shot in the ass with one. Here's a link go and see what ya think.

Jack

Frangible Bullets

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Old 09-11-2009, 01:22 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c3shooter View Post
Frankly, MOST frangibles would not be my first choice- two reasons- very LIGHT bullets (typical 9mm Luger is 100 grains) and very limited penetration. Rounds like the Glaser are considered frangibles, but most are intended for training, steel plate matches, etc. And two layers of drywall are not going to stop a 9mm, frangible or ball.
I didn't think that 9mm was that underpowered. It makes sense I guess. I understand what you are saying. Is Glaser a good choice? Something that won't go through the wall, but is highly effective as an anti-personnell round?
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Old 09-11-2009, 01:26 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IGETEVEN View Post
C3 is correct on what he stated. Frangibles are becoming popular at ranges due to the lead problems. As far a home defense round, I am gonna say it will depend on your choice of firearm or shotty. In this case, bigger may be better. The ballistics can almost be the same and your firearm shoots cooler and cleaner than traditional projectiles with increased velocities at reduced pressures. That being said, it would penetrate Sheetrock, if you miss your target and they do make hollow points. Either way, for range or home defense bullet, I would not want to be shot in the ass with one. Here's a link go and see what ya think.

Jack

Frangible Bullets
Right on. I read your link and it sounds very impressive. I'd have to ask around and see what other people think, but I'm sure I'll get more people's opinions here on this forum thread.
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Old 09-11-2009, 07:09 PM   #6
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Personally, I don't see how you could have a round that will stop/kill a person yet won't penetrate sheetrock.

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Old 09-11-2009, 07:54 PM   #7
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You know, it is confusing, but like in a up close and personal situation like a home break-in, It would be probably no more than 1 foot to 5 foot away, and I don't know about all the new types of rounds out there, but if a round is touted to not penetrate, then why are you using them?

You have to take into consideration on how thick the clothing the person coming at you might have on and if it does not penetrate effectively, you just might pis them off. Of course you do want to penetrate enough that the BG takes notice and stops and that is the whole point of shooting, isn't it? Of course a head shot will stop them right there, but will a frangible do the job at 1 to 2 ft? I know a 230gr will do the job, but at that distance it will pass through.

So just what kind will stop at the distances I stated and will not effectively pass through and will stop with the required power. I do know that when I was shot, it was about 15/30 min before I realized, remember thinking I was pissing on myself and looked and saw the blood. Although the ADRENALIN probably had a lot to do with it, all I am saying is that I didn't feel it until the conflict was over.

Of course we did not have all the exotic rounds that we have now.


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Old 09-11-2009, 08:19 PM   #8
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Much of this discussion can not be blanketed, because of the range of temperatures, and the clothing associated, in those environments.

If someone is breaking into Cane's house in July, or my place in January, the clothing they would be wearing will differ DRAMATICALLY.

When I was in Indy/Chicago, I carried .230gr ball, because I wanted the extra penetration to get through a couple of layers of clothing, which frequently was an undershirt, an overshirt and some sort of jacket.

Having a sub-powered 9mm hollowpoint, in that same condition, would lead to the round expanding too soon and not giving you the penetration you are looking for.

As for Glaser, it's a nice design, but it's not what I would consider a great "stopping" round unless you are shooting someone in either A) An Airplane or B) direct barrel to skin transfer with no clothing in-between.

A real good hollow point, with some force behind it, should begin to expand after it hits it's first layer of protection, so by the time it's entering the skin, it's expanded no more than 10% of 15%, so the real trauma is dumped into the assailant.

This is what I carry, and here are two photos of the "after" projectile in 9mm and .45 ACP

win-ranger.jpg   9mm-ranger.jpg   .45-ranger.jpg  
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Old 09-11-2009, 10:33 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dillinger View Post
Much of this discussion can not be blanketed, because of the range of temperatures, and the clothing associated, in those environments.

If someone is breaking into Cane's house in July, or my place in January, the clothing they would be wearing will differ DRAMATICALLY.

When I was in Indy/Chicago, I carried .230gr ball, because I wanted the extra penetration to get through a couple of layers of clothing, which frequently was an undershirt, an overshirt and some sort of jacket.

Having a sub-powered 9mm hollowpoint, in that same condition, would lead to the round expanding too soon and not giving you the penetration you are looking for.

As for Glaser, it's a nice design, but it's not what I would consider a great "stopping" round unless you are shooting someone in either A) An Airplane or B) direct barrel to skin transfer with no clothing in-between.

A real good hollow point, with some force behind it, should begin to expand after it hits it's first layer of protection, so by the time it's entering the skin, it's expanded no more than 10% of 15%, so the real trauma is dumped into the assailant.

This is what I carry, and here are two photos of the "after" projectile in 9mm and .45 ACP
Wish I could get my .22 rounds to expand like that!
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Old 09-12-2009, 01:07 AM   #10
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I use Winchester's Supreme series Hollow Points. These were recently made the FBI's Standard Service Round.

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