The "Center Mass" Myth - Page 17
Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > Handguns > Concealed Carrying & Personal Protection > The "Center Mass" Myth

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-08-2013, 02:07 PM   #161
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: The Free State of Winston, AL
Posts: 3,034
Liked 1965 Times on 1161 Posts
Likes Given: 930

Default

I teach 'when possible, shot for the upper 1/3' (of the torso)!
But because this is not always possible in a 'real' gunfight centermass is the only way to go when the target is moving or is about to move.!!!

__________________

An armed society is not always a polite society, but it is a free and safe society!
Self Defense is an absolute and natural right!
Keep your head down and your powder dry!

JimRau is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2013, 02:11 PM   #162
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: The Free State of Winston, AL
Posts: 3,034
Liked 1965 Times on 1161 Posts
Likes Given: 930

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TekGreg View Post
Just a quick analysis of a Winchester .223, 55gr FMJ shows that a 100 yard zero means the bullet is only .2" HIGH at 50 yards (before the zero) and falls 1.1" and 3.5" BELOW zero at 150 yds and 200 yds, respectively. At even centimeters higher beyond zero, the bullet would be defying physics! :-O
Unless you know the exact distance between the line of sight and the boreline you can't make any knowledgeable comments on zero and bullet flight.
__________________

An armed society is not always a polite society, but it is a free and safe society!
Self Defense is an absolute and natural right!
Keep your head down and your powder dry!

JimRau is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2013, 02:45 AM   #163
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Chase127's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 160
Liked 17 Times on 13 Posts

Default

I keep reading people stating the goal in a self-defence situation is not to kill ... The fact of the matter is if you don't you open yourself to lawsuit and possible prosecution.So by all means kill the scumbag and do a public service

__________________
Chase127 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2013, 03:15 AM   #164
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
nixfix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 111
Liked 28 Times on 17 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase127
I keep reading people stating the goal in a self-defence situation is not to kill ... The fact of the matter is if you don't you open yourself to lawsuit and possible prosecution.So by all means kill the scumbag and do a public service
Whether or not you actually think that, be cautious about making such remarks in a public forum. This kind of language can come back to haunt you if you are ever involved in a shooting and find yourself as a defendant in a criminal or civil case.
__________________
nixfix is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2013, 08:54 AM   #165
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Posts: 2,831
Liked 1767 Times on 988 Posts
Likes Given: 1302

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chase127 View Post
I keep reading people stating the goal in a self-defence situation is not to kill ... The fact of the matter is if you don't you open yourself to lawsuit and possible prosecution.So by all means kill the scumbag and do a public service
The goal isn't to kill any more than the goal is to shoot to disarm. There is no goal other than to stop the confrontation. If you almost miss and blow the gun out of his hand I would guess the fight would be over. At this point you better not fire again. If you miss high and cause a fatal injury there's no need to fire again. The point is, once the fight is over you need to cease fire, remain alert, and call the police.

In some of the more progressive states the law has caught up with reality. Here in Florida the law forbids civil suits against the defender in a true self defense situation.
__________________
Doc3402 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2013, 11:13 AM   #166
Devil's Advocate and Provocateur
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
TekGreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Cincinnati,OH
Posts: 1,872
Liked 1324 Times on 693 Posts
Likes Given: 607

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc3402

The goal isn't to kill any more than the goal is to shoot to disarm. There is no goal other than to stop the confrontation. If you almost miss and blow the gun out of his hand I would guess the fight would be over. At this point you better not fire again. If you miss high and cause a fatal injury there's no need to fire again. The point is, once the fight is over you need to cease fire, remain alert, and call the police.

In some of the more progressive states the law has caught up with reality. Here in Florida the law forbids civil suits against the defender in a true self defense situation.
"Fire until the aggression towards you, or towards someone you can legally defend, has ceased and no longer presents an immediate danger."

The exact words from my police academy instructor.

The point being that aggression can end in any number of ways, all of which should cause you to quit firing. The BG can turn and run, drop his weapon, fall to the ground from fear, be knocked down, be killed or wounded enough to stop, or any number of possible scenarios. However, we do NOT care what causes him to stop, only that he does. So the proper phraseology is that "we fire until the aggression is stopped." That fits all the legal and politically correct buttons and should br the only phrase to use in public or on a public forum, and is the only proper way to see it if you want to remain within the law.
__________________

.
.
“Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem." (I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.). Thomas Jefferson

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

-Edmund Burke, Loosely translated from Thoughts on the Cause of Present Discontents. (1770)


Last edited by TekGreg; 05-13-2013 at 11:16 AM.
TekGreg is offline  
Cattledog Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2013, 11:59 AM   #167
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Posts: 2,831
Liked 1767 Times on 988 Posts
Likes Given: 1302

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TekGreg View Post
"Fire until the aggression towards you, or towards someone you can legally defend, has ceased and no longer presents an immediate danger."

The exact words from my police academy instructor.

The point being that aggression can end in any number of ways, all of which should cause you to quit firing. The BG can turn and run, drop his weapon, fall to the ground from fear, be knocked down, be killed or wounded enough to stop, or any number of possible scenarios. However, we do NOT care what causes him to stop, only that he does. So the proper phraseology is that "we fire until the aggression is stopped." That fits all the legal and politically correct buttons and should br the only phrase to use in public or on a public forum, and is the only proper way to see it if you want to remain within the law.
Very well put. Back in the good old days our catch phrase was to stop the aggressor from doing what he intends to do. Not only was it a decent catch phrase, it was how you better act unless you wanted to spend the rest of your life making license plates.

Of course we worked in a different world back then. Litigation was nowhere near as much of a problem, political correctness meant punching the right hole on the ballot, and the uniform was respected by all. An officer didn't have anywhere near the problem gaining control that they seem to have these days. In most cases all they had to do was show up.
__________________
Doc3402 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2013, 06:30 AM   #168
Devil's Advocate and Provocateur
FTF_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
TekGreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Cincinnati,OH
Posts: 1,872
Liked 1324 Times on 693 Posts
Likes Given: 607

Default

Ah, the Good Ol' Days, eh, Doc? Where did they go...or, more importantly, how do we get them back?

__________________

.
.
“Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem." (I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.). Thomas Jefferson

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

-Edmund Burke, Loosely translated from Thoughts on the Cause of Present Discontents. (1770)

TekGreg is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2013, 09:24 AM   #169
FTF_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Jacksonville,FL
Posts: 2,831
Liked 1767 Times on 988 Posts
Likes Given: 1302

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TekGreg View Post
Ah, the Good Ol' Days, eh, Doc? Where did they go...or, more importantly, how do we get them back?
*heavy sigh* I don't know. The day we put individual needs ahead of society's needs we lost. One parent doesn't want his kid to say, "One nation, under God" and it becomes a national uproar. The courts gave serious consideration to altering The Pledge of Allegiance in every school in the country because one parent didn't want his little snot generator to have to say the word God every day. As long as we keep allowing stuff like that, we'll never get the good old days back.

We The People? I wish.
__________________
Doc3402 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2013, 04:38 AM   #170
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 258
Liked 23 Times on 19 Posts

Default

I have been reading "American Sniper" and Chris Kyle claims he always aimed at the "center of the mass that was visible"

__________________

Last edited by triggerjob; 05-19-2013 at 04:23 AM.
triggerjob is offline  
JimRau Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Firearms Forum Replies Last Post
Expanded Background Checks Fail in the Senate - The Myth of the "Gun Show Loophole" BPNovum The Club House 3 04-18-2013 04:07 AM
The Myth About the Garand "Ping" Amsdorf Curio & Relic Discussion 25 02-09-2013 04:41 PM
Another mass shooting, another lunatic wielding an "assault rifle" 95sniper Legal and Activism 141 12-21-2012 01:06 PM
"Do "Gun-Free" Zones Encourage School Shootings?" cnorman18 The Club House 26 04-17-2012 09:57 PM
Witloe Remington 1858 New Model Army "Lee" & "Grant" bprevolver Blackpowder & Musket 0 09-25-2008 11:11 PM