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Old 07-07-2012, 06:51 PM   #11
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Totally not related....... What the heck is your profile pic?? It's hard to see on my phone.
what she said. lol
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:03 PM   #12
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I was curious if anyone out there carried handcuffs with their CCW weapon. The reason I ask this is that I was taught in a Powers of Arrest class that, even as a civilian, you must have the ability to restrain for arrest powers to be effective, therefore, even as a civilian, you should carry handcuffs if you CCW to arrest anyone surrendering. However, the current professional civilian CCW training is don't approach, don't touch the perp, wait for the police. This is great for urban areas where police response is fast, but could be a problem in suburban/rural areas. What are your thoughts?

This obviously has a lot of angles to consider, so feel free to jump in with anything that should be considered.
Try handcuffing someone you are performing a citizens arrest on and see how that goes Even if I were wrong 8 ways to Sunday, NO WAY IN HELL IS SOME CIVILIAN STRANGER PUTTING HANDCUFFS ON ME!!!

and as already mentioned, cuffing someone is not as easy as it looks on TV ... just ask my ex-gf who tried and tried while training in the academy to only end up my vict .... er prisoner
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:03 PM   #13
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Consensus here is that CCW with hand cuffs is a bad idea an I concur. Anyone interested in making arrests should become an LEO.

Personally, the only folks I could see a need to handcuff would be an "out of line" LEO and if that ever happens he will be kind enough to bring his own.

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Old 07-07-2012, 07:04 PM   #14
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This came out in another thread a couple weeks ago.

I would in no way carry handcuffs. It's not as easy as it looks on TV, and you can be seriously injured in the process of getting them on if you don't know (or even if you do know) how to do it correctly. I still have a couple scars on my wrist from a training.
Do you happen to remember the thread or can supply a link? I didn't find it in a search.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:09 PM   #15
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A ccw in no way changes your authority in anyway.Even a non ccw holder has the same authority to shoot or not shoot someone if the situation comes up where there's a life or death situation and you "find" a gun(ie 2 bad guys both with guns,one drops his and you pick it up etc)All I'm saying is ccw or no ccw makes no difference here,leave the nra fake ccw badge and 40 dollar handcuffs at home....please.

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Old 07-07-2012, 07:10 PM   #16
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That's a horrible idea.

False imprisonment, kidnapping, could all come from civilian use of cuffs.
If you would've been allowed to kill him at one point, how can it be false imprisonment?

There's also another way to look at it. Assuming you can safely cuff someone (i.e. you cover while someone else does it), then the gun can be holstered. No chance of harm to perp from AD, no misidentification by police when they arrive, and therefore less chance of harm to legal CCW.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:16 PM   #17
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A ccw in no way changes your authority in anyway.Even a non ccw holder has the same authority to shoot or not shoot someone if the situation comes up where there's a life or death situation and you "find" a gun(ie 2 bad guys both with guns,one drops his and you pick it up etc)All I'm saying is ccw or no ccw makes no difference here,leave the nra fake ccw badge and 40 dollar handcuffs at home....please.
Could we leave the fake badges and "playing cop" out of this, please? This was a serious question and I don't want anyone to think that this is about someone out hunting for problems like a vigilante.

No, CCW doesn't change anyone's rights, but if you have a right to kill, then you certainly should have a right to arrest. Does anyone with a legal background know if there is a change in liability by a civilian executing an arrest?
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TekGreg

Could we leave the fake badges and "playing cop" out of this, please? This was a serious question and I don't want anyone to think that this is about someone out hunting for problems like a vigilante.

No, CCW doesn't change anyone's rights, but if you have a right to kill, then you certainly should have a right to arrest. Does anyone with a legal background know if there is a change in liability by a civilian executing an arrest?
You have the right to protect yourself,but detaining someone is not the right of a citizen,if you shoot to kill cause a BG is trying to kill you than that's one thing..if he runs,you let him run.That's the general law,its not your job to arrest someone.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:23 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by TekGreg View Post
No, CCW doesn't change anyone's rights, but if you have a right to kill, then you certainly should have a right to arrest. Does anyone with a legal background know if there is a change in liability by a civilian executing an arrest?
No civilian, CCW or no CCW, has the right to kill anyone. People have the right to defend themselves in many states and in some cases under certain circumstances. In some places people don't even have those rights (NYC for example).


But NOWHERE does a civilian have the right to kill anyone!
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:50 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TekGreg View Post
Could we leave the fake badges and "playing cop" out of this, please? This was a serious question and I don't want anyone to think that this is about someone out hunting for problems like a vigilante.

No, CCW doesn't change anyone's rights, but if you have a right to kill, then you certainly should have a right to arrest. Does anyone with a legal background know if there is a change in liability by a civilian executing an arrest?
No legal background but I would imagine that responding LEOs would review the facts and determine if you engaged in a "citizens arrest" or committed "kidnaping" or "false imprisonment" in the same way they determine if a shooting was a homicide or a justifiable homicide. At the end of the day the investigation will go where it will go.

I do think that adding the wrinkle of a person in cuffs does not bode well for the armed citizen. Personally I may try to detain with the threat of force but if the BG runs, I say let him go. No one is paying me to make the streets safer.

Tack
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