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Old 09-15-2013, 04:47 AM   #11
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Axxe, you hit the nail on the head, taking responsibility for our own safety and the safety of our loved ones. Growing up I was taught this is part of being a man. Times have changed and now I believe this is also part of being a woman. Responsibility seems to have been lost on my generation(born in the 80's).
i think in current times that as many are wanting to be politically correct and want to allow the government to assume the role of protector over their lives, thinking they are better equipped to protect them from bad people with bad intentions. they are more than willing to trade their freedoms for a sense of safety that in all reality is nonexistant and merely a figment of their imaginations.

i will never reliquish the role of protector of my loved ones or allow others to assume that role as long as i am able to fulfill that job. it is my duty and responsibility, not others. i also feel i am responsible for my own safety and know better what good for myself. i teach my wife to be aware and vigilant in her surroundings and to be able to protect herself when i am not around.

i refuse to trade freedom for the illusion of safety.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:48 AM   #12
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The origin of the American civil police servant differs from most other nations. American pioneers ventured into the frontiers and set up governments. In Canada for example the Law went first and established its presence. At Boonesboro, Ky. citizens set up a system of law after they arrived. This set up a system where law enforcement is responsible to the American citizens. Traditionally the first line of defense was the individual citizen.

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Old 09-15-2013, 05:29 AM   #13
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The origin of the American civil police servant differs from most other nations. American pioneers ventured into the frontiers and set up governments. In Canada for example the Law went first and established its presence. At Boonesboro, Ky. citizens set up a system of law after they arrived. This set up a system where law enforcement is responsible to the American citizens.
This is incorrect. Here's some Law Enforcement History 101

American "police" trace their heritage back to the "shire reefs" of Europe, (later shortened to Sheriff.) The office of sheriff traveled to the new world with the colonists. In fact in 1634 the Colony of Virginia was divided into 8 "shires" and a guy named "William Stone" was elected the first sheriff.

The pattern of all modern law enforcement is as follows: when a formal government is set in place, it begins to pass laws. Once laws are passed it must have some type of law enforcement to enforce those laws. If the government does not have or rely on the military to do this, then law enforcement officers are elected by the people or selected by the government (usually FROM the people it governs.) Nitestalker's example of Boonesboro supports this.

Law enforcement's basic job is to enforce laws. It answers to the government it is commissioned by, not the citizens it must enforce the law upon. If law enforcement were answerable to the citizens first and the government second then enforcing the law would be impossible because every citizen would be able to give law enforcement officers direct orders to which that officer would be obliged to comply. So when a citizen violated the law and law enforcement showed up to enforce it the citizen could order the law enforcement officer to stop enforcing the law and leave them alone and he would have to comply.

The advantage of traditional American government is that the governing bodies themselves (not law enforcement directly) is answerable to the citizens. [And the citizens are supposed make/support the laws that are passed. (Now obviously things don't work like that all the time now because our government has grown bloated and corrupt.)] Law enforcement officers swear to enforce the laws and constitutions of the United States, state, parish and city that they work in.

If a United States citizen has a problem with law enforcement properly enforcing a law, their problem is actually with the government that passed the law. The officer making the arrest is simply executing what the government passed. Make sense?

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Traditionally the first line of defense was the individual citizen.
This is correct in general, but not correct in its context because it is referring to America only. The first line of defense has been the individual (usually the head of the household) since before formal government existed in every country in the world.

Anyone who lived in areas where law enforcement was nonexistant, or a long distance away or where law enforcement was overwhelmed kept law and order for themselves. This "tradition" goes back thousands of years and predates the advent of law enforcement which is attributed to the babylonians due to a statement recorded in a letter from Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon in 600 B.C.

Self defense and the ability to defend your loved ones and property from those who would cause them harm is a basic human right and has been since the time of Cain and Abel and is not something that a government or police force should ever attempt to take away. Even when an elected representative government does so through legislation it is a violation of a basic human right and should be cause for a change in government.

All this is covered in the first class taught in the police academy and I have pages and pages of material on it. I have barely scratched the surface, but hopefully i have done a decent job breaking the concept down and you guys will get the basic idea from my ramble.

Edit: obviously police brutality type stuff is an exception to the above post. The police are then in violation of the laws they are supposed to enforce and answerable to both the government who wrote the law and usually through actions through that body that are taken by the citizen, aka criminal charges being pressed and lawsuits being filed and requests for amendments or repealing of the law being enforced at the time.
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Nobody said anything.....about Glocks until you posted about your bacon dog who needs dentures.

What did somebody forget to engage their safety and shoot the dogs front teeth out? Or are we blaming that on the Glock shooters?

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Old 09-22-2013, 03:16 PM   #14
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Where I live defense is a must. We have 25 full time deputies to cover 495 square miles and 61,000 people. In a true emergency you don't know who will respond. You could have anyone from a state trooper to one of the 5 town officers responding. Twice a year the sheriffs department has a citizens academy. The citizens academy is to teach citizens how to secure their own homes and form a community watch. The sheriffs department also organizes ride alongs so citizens know the difference between a suspicious person and a stranger.

We used to have a huge community watch in this area. Now community watch membership is dwindling while crime is rising in the area. We had one home invasion in the area in over 20 years. Most people kept a gun by the door to shoot predators. Now every time we open the weekly paper there is news of another home invasion.

The two small cities we have in the county have a gang problem. Each of the cities have more police officers than the entire county. Yet the people living in the cities will not lift a finger to defend themselves. The won't form a community watch. They don't cooperate with the police when a crime is committed. All they do is storm into county meetings demanding more officers when they already have an officer on every corner. They can't storm into city meetings because they are not open to the public unless the city officials want input from the community.

Since our community watch is dwindling we have more members who are becoming auxiliary deputies. Just about everyone is a volunteer fireman and most of us have been deputized after natural disasters. No one yields to the yellow lights of repair crews but they yield to a blue light even when it is obviously sitting on a citizens personal car. I find this trend very disturbing. We all want services restored after a storm but people endanger workers who are putting in 20 hour days to make our lives normal again. I guess they are in a hurry to get somewhere to complain that no one has power.

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Old 09-22-2013, 03:32 PM   #15
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Where I live defense is a must. We have 25 full time deputies to cover 495 square miles and 61,000 people. In a true emergency you don't know who will respond. You could have anyone from a state trooper to one of the 5 town officers responding. Twice a year the sheriffs department has a citizens academy. The citizens academy is to teach citizens how to secure their own homes and form a community watch. The sheriffs department also organizes ride alongs so citizens know the difference between a suspicious person and a stranger.

We used to have a huge community watch in this area. Now community watch membership is dwindling while crime is rising in the area. We had one home invasion in the area in over 20 years. Most people kept a gun by the door to shoot predators. Now every time we open the weekly paper there is news of another home invasion.

The two small cities we have in the county have a gang problem. Each of the cities have more police officers than the entire county. Yet the people living in the cities will not lift a finger to defend themselves. The won't form a community watch. They don't cooperate with the police when a crime is committed. All they do is storm into county meetings demanding more officers when they already have an officer on every corner. They can't storm into city meetings because they are not open to the public unless the city officials want input from the community.

Since our community watch is dwindling we have more members who are becoming auxiliary deputies. Just about everyone is a volunteer fireman and most of us have been deputized after natural disasters. No one yields to the yellow lights of repair crews but they yield to a blue light even when it is obviously sitting on a citizens personal car. I find this trend very disturbing. We all want services restored after a storm but people endanger workers who are putting in 20 hour days to make our lives normal again. I guess they are in a hurry to get somewhere to complain that no one has power.
people use to move to more rural areas to get away from the gangs, the drugs, lowlifes, the criminals and other violent criminal acts that occur in the bigger cities and towns. well we are seeing that the criminals have also moved their activities to the rural areas as well. we are seeing gang problems and drugs in the smaller towns now as well.

moving to a rural community can decrease the likelyhood of criminal activites, but there is still the chance that it can and will occur.

in the town i live near, with a population of about 1100 people, not a mile from my house in a rural area, three young men lured another young man to a secluded spot on the road i live on and savagely beat him. it was determined to be gang related. the young man that was beaten almost died from his injuries. the three mne involved had run-ins with the law in the past.

yes it happens in small towns and rural areas as well. we need to be prepared to defend ourselves at all times. most of my firearms used for SD are more likely to be used against four legged varmints causing trouble, but will work just as well for two legged varmints looking for trouble.
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Old 09-22-2013, 06:23 PM   #16
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To be fair to the police they cannot possibly be everywhere all the time. So at some point you have to take responsibility for your own safety.
To be even more fair to the police, it's not their fault they can't be everywhere at once. It's our fault. If you want faster response times from public safety, get off your wallet and pay for it. You can have an officer on every corner, but you can't have that and low property taxes. This is why we need to be prepared to defend ourselves and our loved ones.
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:03 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Axxe55

people use to move to more rural areas to get away from the gangs, the drugs, lowlifes, the criminals and other violent criminal acts that occur in the bigger cities and towns. well we are seeing that the criminals have also moved their activities to the rural areas as well. we are seeing gang problems and drugs in the smaller towns now as well.

moving to a rural community can decrease the likelyhood of criminal activites, but there is still the chance that it can and will occur.

in the town i live near, with a population of about 1100 people, not a mile from my house in a rural area, three young men lured another young man to a secluded spot on the road i live on and savagely beat him. it was determined to be gang related. the young man that was beaten almost died from his injuries. the three mne involved had run-ins with the law in the past.

yes it happens in small towns and rural areas as well. we need to be prepared to defend ourselves at all times. most of my firearms used for SD are more likely to be used against four legged varmints causing trouble, but will work just as well for two legged varmints looking for trouble.
In my community the section 8 housing is a short drive from the mall and country club. Its the nicest area of town where everybody thinks they're safe. The street trash commit their armed robberies in the pharmacy parking lot and Walmart parking lot, and their auto thefts and burglaries in the country club. And all of the victims say "I never would have thought this would happen here. This is the nicest area of town."
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Nobody on this thread licked anybody's bodypart.

Nobody said anything.....about Glocks until you posted about your bacon dog who needs dentures.

What did somebody forget to engage their safety and shoot the dogs front teeth out? Or are we blaming that on the Glock shooters?

"Gaston, the Doggy dentist's best friend."
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:07 PM   #18
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In my community the section 8 housing is a short drive from the mall and country club. Its the nicest area of town where everybody thinks they're safe. The street trash commit their armed robberies in the pharmacy parking lot and Walmart parking lot, and their auto thefts and burglaries in the country club. And all of the victims say "I never would have thought this would happen here. This is the nicest area of town."
common sense will tell you that the theives go to the nicer neighborhoods to do their dirty work. they ain't got nothing worth stealing in tha hood!
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:16 PM   #19
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common sense will tell you that the theives go to the nicer neighborhoods to do their dirty work. they ain't got nothing worth stealing in tha hood!
It's the Willie Sutton attitude. When he was asked why he robbed banks he responded that that was where the money was. Makes sense to me.
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:22 PM   #20
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It's the Willie Sutton attitude. When he was asked why he robbed banks he responded that that was where the money was. Makes sense to me.
exactly!

i read somewhere years ago that many thieves don't fool with houses that have those alarm company signs out in front. not because they have an alarm system, but because they probably have already been robbed and don't have anything of value.

i don't know that to be true or not though!
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