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Old 01-07-2014, 12:34 PM   #11
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Bourdain is a pretty open-minded guy. World travel tends to do that to you (I have done my fair share). When your gig is all about blending in with other cultures, you tend to look at similarities instead of differences. I enjoy watching his show, I could care less about his politics.

I too appreciate you sharing this. Unfortunately, those that live in the 'safety' of NYC and other liberal urban hotbeds such as Chi-town won't see anything when they watch this but 'rednecks' and 'republicans' 'clinging to their guns'

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Old 01-08-2014, 04:59 PM   #12
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What really disturbs me is liberals hatred of the NRA. Even liberals who own guns and participate in shooting sports hate the NRA. The NRA has done some things that left a sour taste in my mouth but I don't hate the NRA. Liberals want to support the Daily KOS and the Liberal Gun Club. I see both organizations as a waste of money because they will never get a chance to influence anyone in Congress or at the state level. Moreover, both organizations are for more gun laws instead of enforcing existing gun laws. Existing gun laws have to be enforced and given a chance to work before I will get on board with any more gun laws. The BATF is just as bad as DHS. Neither the BATF or DHS has made very many legitimate arrests. All either origination is willing to do is set up weak minded people or people who are socially inept.

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Old 01-09-2014, 07:06 AM   #13
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What really disturbs me is liberals hatred of the NRA. Even liberals who own guns and participate in shooting sports hate the NRA. The NRA has done some things that left a sour taste in my mouth but I don't hate the NRA. Liberals want to support the Daily KOS and the Liberal Gun Club. I see both organizations as a waste of money because they will never get a chance to influence anyone in Congress or at the state level. Moreover, both organizations are for more gun laws instead of enforcing existing gun laws. Existing gun laws have to be enforced and given a chance to work before I will get on board with any more gun laws. The BATF is just as bad as DHS. Neither the BATF or DHS has made very many legitimate arrests. All either origination is willing to do is set up weak minded people or people who are socially inept.
you could get on board with new gun laws if they started enforcing existing gun laws?

any and all gun laws ever pased are a direct infringement of the 2nd amendment.

to even consider wanting to allow any more gun laws is a highly liberal thought.

new gun laws are not the answer to crime and violence and never have been.

every gun law, restriction and ban ever passed has been about control. controlling those who own guns and an attempt at seperation of the citizen from his guns. they may have been fed to the sheeple as measures to make them feel safer and that they are being used FOOG, but it's never been about crime or violence, but about the government controlling the citizens.

support of the 2nd amendment is either all the way in or all the way out. there is no middle ground or grey areas when you say you support the 2nd amendment. IMO, anyone that would even consider thinking new gun laws were a good thing doesn't support the 2nd amendment.
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Old 01-12-2014, 03:43 AM   #14
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I spent several posts last summer on another hobby board trying to agree with very conservative friend who could not allow me the luxury of both calling myself "a liberal" and supporting the 2A to the fullest extent.

I argued I've always leaned left in nearly every issue, and yet there were some glaring exceptions that confused him and he accused me of "not knowing who I was."

I thought this absurd, but I had one of those epiphany moments (like Col Kurtz in Apocalypse now-- diamond bullet through the brain) that the LABEL (liberal) was the big problem.

Our politics is rife with gridlock simply because a platform idealcontrols the entire conversation. We can't vote on separate issues anymore.

We forget that people are diverse, and fundamentally should be allowed to disagree. After all, that's what the 1A is all about.

Labeling people is a real shortcut to thinking. And that does everyone a disservice.

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Old 01-12-2014, 04:00 AM   #15
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I spent several posts last summer on another hobby board trying to agree with very conservative friend who could not allow me the luxury of both calling myself "a liberal" and supporting the 2A to the fullest extent.

I argued I've always leaned left in nearly every issue, and yet there were some glaring exceptions that confused him and he accused me of "not knowing who I was."

I thought this absurd, but I had one of those epiphany moments (like Col Kurtz in Apocalypse now-- diamond bullet through the brain) that the LABEL (liberal) was the big problem.

Our politics is rife with gridlock simply because a platform idealcontrols the entire conversation. We can't vote on separate issues anymore.

We forget that people are diverse, and fundamentally should be allowed to disagree. After all, that's what the 1A is all about.

Labeling people is a real shortcut to thinking. And that does everyone a disservice.
I use the label I think for my self lol
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Old 01-12-2014, 09:37 AM   #16
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I spent several posts last summer on another hobby board trying to agree with very conservative friend who could not allow me the luxury of both calling myself "a liberal" and supporting the 2A to the fullest extent.

I argued I've always leaned left in nearly every issue, and yet there were some glaring exceptions that confused him and he accused me of "not knowing who I was."

I thought this absurd, but I had one of those epiphany moments (like Col Kurtz in Apocalypse now-- diamond bullet through the brain) that the LABEL (liberal) was the big problem.

Our politics is rife with gridlock simply because a platform idealcontrols the entire conversation. We can't vote on separate issues anymore.

We forget that people are diverse, and fundamentally should be allowed to disagree. After all, that's what the 1A is all about.

Labeling people is a real shortcut to thinking. And that does everyone a disservice.
Hey there fellow CNYer! Welcome to the FTF! Love the warming trend eh? Almost 30 degrees out there! Go 'Cuse, Go Orange!!

Your point is reasonable but more often than not I find were the one that labels ourselves before others label us. My sister is ultra left and finds nothing offensive about being called a Liberal just dont call her late for an entitlement, then she will get angry!

35 years ago, I was a self described liberal type, long hair, the works. 21 years of the Military, wife, kids, grandkids and lots of hard work have changed me bigtime. My personal feelings and thoughts may now be considered pretty Conservative but I would argue that they really are just completely American.

Your from Syracuse, that would be one of our few "Liberal Bastian's" upstate. You realize of course that the population/ mindset in that 30 square miles is very different than the one for 10000 square miles surrounding it correct? Its also the only region for that same 10000 square miles that has shootings, muggings, rapes and murders as a regular occurrence almost weekly.

Those in NYC wouldnt see the same thing Im saying here because they dont recognize a couple few felonies a month as trending when they themselves experience that daily. What your saying has as much to do with your locality as it does your mindset. Im only 40 miles from you but its a divide that could be a whole ocean wide, the voters just one school district away from your district have a much different viewpoint than yours as well as a very divergent demographic.

I would like to say I wont be calling anyone names per-se unless they step outside of the Basis for our rules of law which is the Constitution and BOR's. You yourself quoted the 1A so Im sure you realize that real Americans support all the A's not just the ones we personally appreciate and use. Neither the Republican nor Democrat "Platforms" are American in origin. I cant and wont support a candidate because of their party politics, only their proven ability to parse out the PC, FOOG and BS from the meat of why we elect them to represent us, our region and our nation.

Lastly, I think you may have referred to the FTF as a Hobby Board. That might be for some folks here but the majority would call feeding and defending their families and Homes and being prepared to mount an offense against our own government if it becomes "Tyrannical" as much more than a hobby, more like a way of life.
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Old 01-12-2014, 06:54 PM   #17
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Thanks for the welcome WebleyFosbery38. My favorite Mt. Bike trail is in your neck of the woods -- Shindagin Hollow State Forest.

I agree with you on one's perspective being shaped by his immediate locale. And it is easy to be an idealist when the battles being fought are via keyboard and they don't immediately influence the ability to put food on the table, or protect one's family.

And I didn't mean to imply FTF is "only" a "hobby board." I really meant I'm active on line in many hobbies. I realize the decision to own a gun is akin to a serious decision like having a child-- one needs to take precautions, and think of its care, feeding and protection, as one would with any potentially dangerous item and associated activities.

Regarding the BOR: I'm amazed more people don't realize how badly it has been eroded. All so much "for our own protection." And much of that has happened since 9/11. It saddens me how little people seem to care. It's not the stuff you can simply bring up at family BBQs-- politics being one of the taboo subjects next to religion, etc. And our media certainly isn't helping to educate and inform -- a necessary item for self governance. Too much trust is given, and "sheeple" just go along with the flow. Why that is can be argued, and conspiracies offered if you like.

I don't like laws that seek to protect us from ourselves - period. They treat us like children. Stuff like the NY Safe Act is so abhorrent I can't believe some people just go along with it -- especially when considering HOW it was passed (Andy signed on my birthday!). I was talking with someone at the ammo aisle in Walmart yesterday who wasn't even aware that the Safe Act now prohibits internet sales of ammunition into NY. And soon we'll have to get NICS checks every time we buy one box of ammo!? Come on, that's just silly.

I really identify with the thrust of the libertarian movement, and wish we could evolve to laws which are based only on protection of property rights, and non aggression. Keep the liberals out of my wallet, and conservatives out of my bedroom. I know we're just too far along the path of regulatory agencies to turn back. I mean, we need clean air and water, and safe food and can't just suddenly trust good business ethics would work everything out if we suddenly defunded the FDA and EPA, no matter how ineffectual I believe they have become in many areas -- bending to the powers of big business without ethics.

I mostly call myself "liberal" because I see myself as a "think out of the box" person all day long. I have many hobbies, appreciate creativity in all forms, support the scientific process (no matter what that means for anyone's religions fundamental beliefs) and love to argue a point-- if only so I can refine my own position. I don't mind being wrong if I've learned from the process, and I'll gladly say so when I am wrong. The Sandy Hook fiasco really woke me up on the gun issue last year, and now I'm 100% in line with those who support the 2A, the entire tyranny argument, oath protection and all that means.

But I absolutely hate ignorance. And I'll call out anyone when they exhibit it. Show me data, and your sources, and we'll compare notes. Stick to your values, and tell me what they are if you like, but if your argument is showing cracks I don't care if I ruffle feathers showing them to you. Most people think that is being "liberal" and academia abounds with such folks.

What is so amazing to me is how many academic "liberals" (reference Tompkins County as a glaring red sore on this map) :

http://www.nysaferesolutions.com/

seem to ignore crime stats and adopt a gun control position that I can only attribute to ignorance and fear. Everything I've seen shows gun control does not work, and I really don't understand how an informed position could conclude otherwise.

It seems like ivory tower gun control idealism to the point where academics simply want to "wish away" all guns and therefore we'll be safe -- not knowing anything about how guns work, or what laws actually do. That's ignorance.

Am I liberal? I don't think it matters. In some ways-- of course. Others definitely not. Label me at your own peril I say, as I strive not to label others this way.

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Old 01-12-2014, 07:18 PM   #18
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Liberal, to me, means someone who is perfectly OK with letting the government micro-manage our lives. That might be OK if we had an honest government that existed for the benefit of the citizens. But our government is full of self-serving crooks who have not the well-being of the citizens at heart. And to let the government disarm us is to give those crooks free rein over us, including robbing us of our money, our property, and our freedom. But the "conservative" piece of the government is just more of the same. They are intent in consolidating the wealth into the hands of a few filthy rich tycoons who would turn the rest of us into slaves. Two opposite approaches to the same end. We really need a 3rd party that will repeal the abusive legislation and revive the Constitution, but that is like wishing for Heaven on Earth.

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Old 01-13-2014, 10:21 AM   #19
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Thanks for the welcome WebleyFosbery38. My favorite Mt. Bike trail is in your neck of the woods -- Shindagin Hollow State Forest.

I agree with you on one's perspective being shaped by his immediate locale. And it is easy to be an idealist when the battles being fought are via keyboard and they don't immediately influence the ability to put food on the table, or protect one's family.

And I didn't mean to imply FTF is "only" a "hobby board." I really meant I'm active on line in many hobbies. I realize the decision to own a gun is akin to a serious decision like having a child-- one needs to take precautions, and think of its care, feeding and protection, as one would with any potentially dangerous item and associated activities.

Regarding the BOR: I'm amazed more people don't realize how badly it has been eroded. All so much "for our own protection." And much of that has happened since 9/11. It saddens me how little people seem to care. It's not the stuff you can simply bring up at family BBQs-- politics being one of the taboo subjects next to religion, etc. And our media certainly isn't helping to educate and inform -- a necessary item for self governance. Too much trust is given, and "sheeple" just go along with the flow. Why that is can be argued, and conspiracies offered if you like.

I don't like laws that seek to protect us from ourselves - period. They treat us like children. Stuff like the NY Safe Act is so abhorrent I can't believe some people just go along with it -- especially when considering HOW it was passed (Andy signed on my birthday!). I was talking with someone at the ammo aisle in Walmart yesterday who wasn't even aware that the Safe Act now prohibits internet sales of ammunition into NY. And soon we'll have to get NICS checks every time we buy one box of ammo!? Come on, that's just silly.

I really identify with the thrust of the libertarian movement, and wish we could evolve to laws which are based only on protection of property rights, and non aggression. Keep the liberals out of my wallet, and conservatives out of my bedroom. I know we're just too far along the path of regulatory agencies to turn back. I mean, we need clean air and water, and safe food and can't just suddenly trust good business ethics would work everything out if we suddenly defunded the FDA and EPA, no matter how ineffectual I believe they have become in many areas -- bending to the powers of big business without ethics.

I mostly call myself "liberal" because I see myself as a "think out of the box" person all day long. I have many hobbies, appreciate creativity in all forms, support the scientific process (no matter what that means for anyone's religions fundamental beliefs) and love to argue a point-- if only so I can refine my own position. I don't mind being wrong if I've learned from the process, and I'll gladly say so when I am wrong. The Sandy Hook fiasco really woke me up on the gun issue last year, and now I'm 100% in line with those who support the 2A, the entire tyranny argument, oath protection and all that means.

But I absolutely hate ignorance. And I'll call out anyone when they exhibit it. Show me data, and your sources, and we'll compare notes. Stick to your values, and tell me what they are if you like, but if your argument is showing cracks I don't care if I ruffle feathers showing them to you. Most people think that is being "liberal" and academia abounds with such folks.

What is so amazing to me is how many academic "liberals" (reference Tompkins County as a glaring red sore on this map) :

http://www.nysaferesolutions.com/

seem to ignore crime stats and adopt a gun control position that I can only attribute to ignorance and fear. Everything I've seen shows gun control does not work, and I really don't understand how an informed position could conclude otherwise.

It seems like ivory tower gun control idealism to the point where academics simply want to "wish away" all guns and therefore we'll be safe -- not knowing anything about how guns work, or what laws actually do. That's ignorance.

Am I liberal? I don't think it matters. In some ways-- of course. Others definitely not. Label me at your own peril I say, as I strive not to label others this way.
WindJ, after reading your response, I think your not a Liberal, your an American! Being so is much more influential than any Political party for sure! Besides, being less than an American is just posing for a platform that will drop out on you the second you need it! Glad to have you here, we need more New Yorkers involved, tell your friends, join FTF and participate!!!!

Quote:
WindJ--"I mostly call myself "American" because I see myself as a "think out of the box" person all day long"
That sounds better now doesnt it?

No problem with the Hobby Board thing, there are probably lots of folks who do consider it a hobby. Sadly, most of those folks are the ones that generally accept Fettering of it without much of a fuss because it doesnt restrict their fun. They can still head to a firing range and shoot any weapon they pay to fire even if they cant own it. To the rest of us, that just means desirable pieces for SD and anti tyranny will be locked in a vault out of reach when we need them most.


Your correct, humans is so smart now adays they think that BOR's are vestigial and we can compromise them For Our Own Good to make the world a safer place. Yes we can compromise them for ourselves but no we cant for our fellow citizens. Thats a power left only to a Constitutional Convention not Republicrat Bi-Parts! Drives me crazy that they dont see why they have the crime only that they have it. The areas 5 miles from Syracuse are safe to walk 24/7 while M street could be your last walk if you do it after dark.

Ironically, the home of one of the best firearm manufacturers of all times (I have a few of their pieces, love them), Ithaca has been taken over by Vietnam Protestors and other folks that wish to resurrect Kennedy as Prime Minister of the Nation, dead or alive (Doesnt really matter to them that Kennedy really didnt do anything but screw round on his wife and spend his dads booze running money)!!!! Our Tompkins "neighbors" are mostly imports and the shunned, having 2 huge Universities/ Colleges and nothing else has created a utopia of Liberalism in a Vast Conservative expanse. Truly one of the only true Democrat strongholds in all of upstate, rich and influential, lots of $10K a plate dinners on their calenders!

See ya round WindJunkie!
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Old 01-13-2014, 01:50 PM   #20
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What really disturbs me is liberals hatred of the NRA. .
Ignorance breeds hatred.
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