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Old 04-22-2011, 09:49 PM   #11
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Here is three 6 round groups at 14 yards with the 2 3/4" Security Six using my favorite load: 158 grain Hornady XTP:

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The only 357 magnum to me is the Ruger Security Six!!
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Old 04-22-2011, 10:40 PM   #12
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Very nice wheel guns I especially like the Security Sixes!
I drool every time I see my dad's stainless Security Six, maybe one day I'll have the money to get one when I come across one.

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Old 04-23-2011, 11:32 AM   #13
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Default Rugers:)

mesinge2: Sir, I enjoyed your pictures, and your explanations

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Old 04-23-2011, 03:01 PM   #14
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Wow!! Nice collection......

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Old 04-23-2011, 03:06 PM   #15
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Default 3" inch K frames

Before we talk K frames. Let's talk S&W model numbers. Prior to 1957 S&W named weapons such as the "chief's special." But later they went to model numbers. Now these rules are some times violated but the people that made them, but we'll let that slide. Anyway, S&W denotes any two digit number that does not start with a 6 to be carbon steel that is blued or nickel (19, 27, 28, 29, and so on); generally if it starts with a 6 it is stainless steel (64, 65, 627, 629, and so on); if is starts with a 3 that means scandium, and if I remember correctly 4 means aluminum but it looks blued. Now for when S&W breaks S&W's self-imposed model number rules: Take, for example, the second gun to the bottom in the picture bellow, the humpback one. Its a 638, that should mean stainless steel, but its frame is made out of aluminum. hmmm... So I guess because it appears "stainless" that it has stainless model number. For the sake of space, I will stop here.

oh well, let's talk K frames




Well my most used and carried Smith & Wesson Revolver is my model 19-4 (the blued model wearing the Lamo Camo grips pictured above). It was commonly reffered to the as the Combat Magnum. It was designed for those that wanted the fire-power of the model 27 N frame (large frame) 6-shot 357 but didn't want the weight or size the N frame provided. The smaller frame has a flaw however.

In the K-frame magnums, the forcing cone dimensions combined with the barrel shank dimensions results in a relatively thin shank at the 6 o'clock position, where a machine cut is made to clear the crane. Basically the forcing cone of the barrel is thinner at the bottom of the barrel where the bullet enters from the chamber. This, combined with numerous report of the forcing cone cracking has lead to a scare accross the interwebz about K frame magnums.

The problem, however, was less to do with the forcing cone and more to due with improper maintenance and the super hot ammo of the time. Firstly, when lead .38 SPL ammo was regularly shot through the guns for practice then followed by hot jacketed 125 gr. loads the pressure on the thin metal at the area of the forcing cone was increased leading to cracks. Secondly, Super Vel ammunition's .357 magnum 125gr. loads in popular use at the time resulted in most all documented cases of barrel cracking had the bullets moving along at 1700 or more fps with commensurate energy levels. Even their .38 special loadings (in 110gr.) had been clocked at over 1200 fps! The story "cracked forcing cones" gets repeated, but never the details. Later due to these problems Smith & Wesson moved to the L frame models, which are nothing but beefy K frames, without the class

Now to a question I often get asked: What does -4 mean? Well it depends on the model in question. They are revisions of the same gun with minor changes. On the model 19, the ones I know are as follows:

19-1 (1959): Change extractor rod, right to left-hand thread.
19-2 (1961): Cylinder stop changed, delete triggerguard screw.
19-3 (1967): Relocation of rear sight leaf screw.
19-4 (1977): Change gas ring from yoke to cylinder. (cost-cutting measure)
19-5 (1982): Eliminate cylinder counterbore.

The other K frame is a model 64, the stainless version of the venerable model 10. Mine is a 3" heavy barrel model in .38 SPL (the .357 model is the model 65). A supremely accurate weapon that often out shoots my 4" and 5" barrel models. I find the K frame 3" barrel model is the perfect balance between concealability and shootability.

Happy to answer any questions.

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Old 04-23-2011, 04:05 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
very nice and some of the guns have real nice grips
how does the Taurus work for you? I recently purchased a 22magnum but its still in the box and unused
Sorry, for the late answer but I didn't see the question before. The 22 mag is a hand full without the ability to full your hand. Its fun with 22 LR rounds and cylinder but the muzzle flip is so exagerated with the magnum rounds that I feel as if I am going to drop it. Also, if you think you can shoot it from your pocket think again:



On the Taurus question, which one? I have 4 up there. A .38 SPL model 85 without hammer spur, the judge (not practical, but fun), the 8-shot 357 magnum 608, and the 9mm model 905 snubbie. I like Taurus's revolvers, but don't trust their pistols; I have had bad experiences with their pistols.
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Old 04-25-2011, 03:00 PM   #17
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I purchased a Taurus Judge when they first came out. I just wanted it as a fun range gun. And man, I tell you it got bad press on the interwebz faster than the 45 colt it fires travels. I don't carry it as a SD weapon. I prefer a 357 K/L sized frame revolver or a government 1911. With that said, and with those people all a twitter of their tiny .380s; if given a choice between an LCP/P238/P3AT or a Judge. It be a judge.

Now to the report: I was impressed with the 45LC ammo, and the small shot ammo. This target is some #7 (or #7 1/2 or #8 I can't remember) shot ammo and Winchester silvertip 225 grain .45 Colt ammo at 7-yards. It is two cylinders loaded in this order: shot, shot, 45, 45, 45; then shot, 45, 45, 45, 45. I figure the shot shell distracts and the Colts finish the job.



Then came the buckshot, the spread with the long-gun designed ammo is crazy. The following is 5 subsequent shots with Winchester Super-X .410 Bore 2 1/2" OOO Buck with 3 pellets from the 2.5" Chamber Judge with 3" Barrel at 14 yards.




Then I tried the Federal Premium Personal Defense .410 Handgun 2 1/2" OOO Buckshot with 4 pellets. This is the same gun and the same range (14 yards):




Amazing improvement. I think the trick is that the pellets of the Federal are contained within the wad therefore clustering the shot.



Quote:
Taurus Judge, 3" barrel, 2.5" chamber,
8' to Chrony

Federal 4 pellet 000 buck load
859, 874, 868 fps

Winchester 3 pellet 000 buck load
981, 928, 975 fps

Remington #9 shot (for reference)
901, 955, 930 fps

45 Colt load
758, 780 fps
With these velocities and the 71 grain ball weight it is like four 36 percussion balls hitting in a space of 2.5 inches. My thinking is that Jesse James killed pretty well with a 36 percussion and 20 ball rounds in five pulls of the trigger is impressive. The buckshot might not be the best but the gun seems fine as a defensive weapon the way I have it loaded: with a Wincheter 000 buck with the wide spread first, followed by the tight spread of the Federal 000 buck, then three .45 Colts. I would not want to be on the other side of this!
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Old 04-25-2011, 05:17 PM   #18
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Very nice collection.

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Old 04-25-2011, 07:22 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mesinge2 View Post
First, the Security Six has a full size grip frame compared to the GP100's "stub" grip frame.
Not to jack the thread, but anybody know why they did this? My nephew wants GP100-style grips (old style, with the rosewood inset) for his Redhawk, but can't find them due to the difference in frame style, grip stub vs. full frame.

Also, i was glad to see that the purpose-made shot ammo for the Judge grouped better than the long-gun feed. I wonder about the specialty rounds that have a few shot and three mini-slug things that look like watch batteries & their impact.
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Old 04-25-2011, 09:31 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orangello View Post
Not to jack the thread, but anybody know why they did this? My nephew wants GP100-style grips (old style, with the rosewood inset) for his Redhawk, but can't find them due to the difference in frame style, grip stub vs. full frame.

Also, i was glad to see that the purpose-made shot ammo for the Judge grouped better than the long-gun feed. I wonder about the specialty rounds that have a few shot and three mini-slug things that look like watch batteries & their impact.
Its not a Hijack at all that is the purpose of this thread.

If you have a question, ask away.

As to your question: It was done to shorten the grip for concealment and the abbreviated grip frame of the GP-100 reduces the overall weight of the gun significantly. Yet, they made up for the weight reduction with the full under-lug barrel. Go figure,
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