[Yunus]

Originally Posted by 97cobra

So a .22 incapacitates with an equal number of rounds as a rifle or shotgun? And a 9mm is less lethal than a .380 or .25 ACP? I find that chart a bit hard to believe.

You have to read the text that explains it as well.

Some people will look at this data and say "He's telling us all to carry .22s". That's not true. Although this study showed that the percentages of people stopped with one shot are similar between almost all handgun cartridges, there's more to the story. Take a look at two numbers: the percentage of people who did not stop (no matter how many rounds were fired into them) and the one-shot-stop percentage. The lower caliber rounds (.22, .25, .32) had a failure rate that was roughly double that of the higher caliber rounds. The one-shot-stop percentage (where I considered all hits, anywhere on the body) trended generally higher as the round gets more powerful. This tells us a couple of things...

In a certain (fairly high) percentage of shootings, people stop their aggressive actions after being hit with one round regardless of caliber or shot placement. These people are likely NOT physically incapacitated by the bullet. They just don't want to be shot anymore and give up! Call it a psychological stop if you will. Any bullet or caliber combination will likely yield similar results in those cases. And fortunately for us, there are a lot of these "psychological stops" occurring. The problem we have is when we don't get a psychological stop. If our attacker fights through the pain and continues to victimize us, we might want a round that causes the most damage possible. In essence, we are relying on a "physical stop" rather than a "psychological" one. In order to physically force someone to stop their violent actions we need to either hit him in the Central Nervous System (brain or upper spine) or cause enough bleeding that he becomes unconscious. The more powerful rounds look to be better at doing this.

TL : DR
Many attackers will stop after being hit by any bullet, it doesn't mean they physically could not continue just that they don't.
.22's also had about double the larger rounds failure to incapacitate %.

[levelcross]

What bullet is best? It's one you can shoot accurately under stress that's capable of penetrating deeply enough to inflict fatal hemorrhage and reliably functions in your gun. There's nothing mystical or complicated about handgun ammunition wounding effectiveness. It's simple: placement and penetration.

Good information, take it for what it is, one mans opinion and some decent research. I agree with most of it and found nothing that I can file under the BS file. Take this and use it to your advantage like the quote above.

Too many people take what they see in the movies and TV shows as to what is really going to happen, so where do I get one of those 37 shot revolvers???

[WilliamTF]

As someone who has bowhunted for 22 years where penatration and blood loss is what your going for I want a pass through shot. I don't want someone behind the BG but when your talking about blood loss trust me two holes are better. As I've said before I'm a big fan of velocity when selecting a bullet I usually go with a light for caliber bullet. The debate over penetration could go on and on with which has better penatration fast or heavy? I choose fast. A 115 gr 9mm bullet has the same width as a 147gr 9mm as does a 135gr .40 vs 180gr .40. Ill put my faith in that extra cpl hundred fps vs an extra 20 or 30 grains of bullet. Just my .02

[DodgerBlue]

Originally Posted by Balota

Don't you just hate it when you have second thoughts about a post? The natural followup to my previous conclusion is that we should practice with and learn to use accurately the largest caliber weapon we can afford. After reading the link to the medical examiners thread, a nice heavy 45 caliber round sounds like the best plan.

My current weapon is a 9mm. I've been thinking about getting a 45 for a little while. Now I'm thinking about it a lot harder!

When I first moved to Arizona and started enjoying true gun freedom, I got several 9mm. IDK why, i just kept buying 9mm.

I sold em all. I now roll a Sig Scorpion .45 230 gr. JHP and a Beretta .40 s&w PX4sc. 188 gr. JHP

I swore off 9mm.

[97cobra]

Originally Posted by Yunus

You have to read the text that explains it as well.

TL : DR
Many attackers will stop after being hit by any bullet, it doesn't mean they physically could not continue just that they don't.
.22's also had about double the larger rounds failure to incapacitate %.

I'm an idiot. I didn't read any of the text at all I just saw the graph and was kinda puzzled.

Originally Posted by levelcross

What bullet is best? It's one you can shoot accurately under stress that's capable of penetrating deeply enough to inflict fatal hemorrhage and reliably functions in your gun. There's nothing mystical or complicated about handgun ammunition wounding effectiveness. It's simple: placement and penetration.

Good information, take it for what it is, one mans opinion and some decent research. I agree with most of it and found nothing that I can file under the BS file. Take this and use it to your advantage like the quote above.

Too many people take what they see in the movies and TV shows as to what is really going to happen, so where do I get one of those 37 shot revolvers???

Didn't the actually make 20 shot revolvers?

[GunRunner]

Originally Posted by 97cobra

I'm an idiot. I didn't read any of the text at all I just saw the graph and was kinda puzzled.

Didn't the actually make 20 shot revolvers?

Yes, I saw it on Son of Guns.

[big440dart]

Its not as much what caliber as the design of round a balistic tip .25 "can" do more damage than a say 9mm fmj because every bullet needs to open up and create shrapnl before it exits it's target otherwise your wound cavity is very minimal. And personally i think the round should stop just before exit because then I know it has done its job

[big440dart]

Originally Posted by trip286

nuh-uh, my brother's cousin's sister's boyfriend's uncle has been a gunsmith and a reloader for over 150 years, and he says rim fire is more reliable. He's been reloading .22 short for 75 years alone.

Ummm how old is this guy 200+???? and i was un aware you can reload rimfires since you just smashed part of the case

[c3shooter]

Big- you need to work on recognition of sarcasm and hyperbole. That post was very much tongue in cheek.

Sort of like "There I was, just me and Davy Crockett- shoulder to shoulder on the walls of the Alamo......"

[big440dart]

Originally Posted by c3shooter

Big- you need to work on recognition of sarcasm and hyperbole. That post was very much tongue in cheek.

Sort of like "There I was, just me and Davy Crockett- shoulder to shoulder on the walls of the Alamo......"

Haha I know. I was hoping he was being sarcastic but Ive heard some wacky stuff on here haha