Handgun discussion thrown off course...
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Old 10-24-2008, 09:51 PM   #1
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Default Handgun discussion thrown off course...

First, people try and choose 'fighting/shtf/whatever' weapons based on looks, feel, all sorts of crap, none of which is anything more than a training/mindset issue. Get over it. Here's a good for instance. I offer free training, about once a month. Hundreds if not thousands of people read these posts on multiple forums (here, glocktalk, ar-15, etc). Free. Hell, donate 10.00 to help cover targets if you want. FREE. Did I mention free? How many take me up on it? 3 - 5 usually. Most don't like the fact that its not a day of bumpfire and general asshattery and that real training is tough. Wanna be hard? Train hard. The reality is that most people are sheep who are totally unprepared for when the wolf comes knocking. But its easier to be blissfully ignorant than to train hard.

Its even harder to swallow your when someone is trying to say, hey, your choices are 'farked up and in front' and you have to face the fact that you're not experienced enough to realize that you don't know what you don't know. I've been there (not knowing what I don't know). Now its my turn to try and help people move from unconscious incompetence to conscious incompetence at the very least.

Saying 'Glocks suck' is simply baiting. Specifically: I don't like aftermarket 1911's (no, I'm not including mil-spec weapons) because I see to many of them fail during training & practice. I don't like XD's because I've seen too many of them fail during training & practice. I don't like DPMS and Olympic ARs because I've seen too many of them fail during training & practice. I don't simply say X sucks, period, I try to speak from either personal experience or trusted sources (people who shoot people for a living) whenever possible.

No, war gods don't piss on Glocks to make them any more amazing or beautiful, but when it needs to go bang, Glocks seem to have their sh!t together.

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Old 10-24-2008, 11:02 PM   #2
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I knew that comment I made about Glocks would set you off....lol.

Just trying to have fun with you, that's all.

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Wanna be hard? Train hard. The reality is that most people are sheep who are totally unprepared for when the wolf comes knocking. But its easier to be blissfully ignorant than to train hard.
Though we were talking about XDs and Glocks, not training. Who on this forum doesn't train hard? You sayin you're more hard core than the rest of us?

I just wanted to mess with you because you had no right to jump on the OP's reasoning behind choosing the XD over the Glock. Both are great pistols, I've seen both models jam up (and I don't want to hear any crap about "limp-wristing" or anything). Heck, I've seen an old Beretta outperform a Glock. All pistols can jam occasionally. It's a fact of life.

The least you could do is be supportive of the OPs choice of weapon, and try to give him useful advice regarding his new purchase.
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Old 10-24-2008, 11:49 PM   #3
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I offer free training, about once a month. Hundreds if not thousands of people read these posts on multiple forums (here, glocktalk, ar-15, etc). Free. Hell, donate 10.00 to help cover targets if you want. FREE. Did I mention free? How many take me up on it? 3 - 5 usually.
Kelly - No offense, but if you and your buddies are going to spend all day running down my gear, making fun of me for purchasing sling X when OBVIOUSLY Sling Y should have been purchased and generally have no interest in the common "sheeple" being there because they don't have that magic 1% mindset, why would you expect people would be beating down your door?

It appears that no one can really make the right choice if it isn't one that you and your friends use daily. I'm sorry, but there are other teams out there, there are other people who train and there are other people who "shoot people for a living" that do indeed feel differently about some of the products that your friends don't like.

It's a big world dude, and somewhere in it there could be the next big thing and it could end up being stamped with a company name you don't like ( Olympic Arms, DPMS, High End 1911 ltd, what have you )
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Old 10-25-2008, 12:04 AM   #4
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You can come to my training if you want, KellyTTE.

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Old 10-25-2008, 12:53 AM   #5
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I knew that comment I made about Glocks would set you off....lol.
Despite what you might think, I'm no Glock kool-ade drinker. If I had the funds, I'd be converting to S&W M&P9s. I consider them to be a 'product improved' platform.

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I just wanted to mess with you because you had no right to jump on the OP's reasoning behind choosing the XD over the Glock. Both are great pistols, I've seen both models jam up (and I don't want to hear any crap about "limp-wristing" or anything). Heck, I've seen an old Beretta outperform a Glock. All pistols can jam occasionally. It's a fact of life.

The least you could do is be supportive of the OPs choice of weapon, and try to give him useful advice regarding his new purchase.
Why? He gets a pass on a bad decision? If you post a decision on an open forum, then you take the good with the bad. Tough titty for him.

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Kelly - No offense, but if you and your buddies are going to spend all day running down my gear, making fun of me for purchasing sling X when OBVIOUSLY Sling Y should have been purchased and generally have no interest in the common "sheeple" being there because they don't have that magic 1% mindset, why would you expect people would be beating down your door?
Actually, I don't really say a lot about peoples gear selection. Most of the time, it sorts itself out. Slings break, rifles die, holsters tear, vests fail. Ahhhhh yes the sweet taste of low price with a hint of bitter buyers remorse.*chuckles*
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:05 AM   #6
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Actually, I don't really say a lot about peoples gear selection. Most of the time, it sorts itself out. Slings break, rifles die, holsters tear, vests fail. Ahhhhh yes the sweet taste of low price with a hint of bitter buyers remorse.*chuckles*
And this is exactly what I am talking about. You sound just exactly like every other Elite Team Fighter on the Internetz. Someone who thinks that only the gear he and his merry men have personally signed, sealed and approved is "worthy" to enter into Asgard and grace the very halls of Valhalla itself.

You mind if I ask you a question, completely off the OP's topic, but I seriously have a question and I want to know if you are going to be okay with me asking it here, or would you prefer a PM?

You see, I have read some of the stuff on your site. The reviews and stuff. It's all quite nice stuff. Weapons cases from $350. Flash suppressors from $120 to $150. This, that, and the other high end, tactical unit of the moment. Great stuff, it would appear, but not a hell of a lot of it would actually fit into a standard US Military Soldier's budget, or the common working man for that matter.

But, I digress, I have an honest question - would you be willing to answer it truthfully in the open? Or would you prefer a PM?

Thanks,
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:21 AM   #7
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KellyTTE:

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Why? He gets a pass on a bad decision? If you post a decision on an open forum, then you take the good with the bad. Tough titty for him.
Why is his decision bad? XD is a perfectly good choice.

KellyTTE:
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Actually, I don't really say a lot about peoples gear selection. Most of the time, it sorts itself out. Slings break, rifles die, holsters tear, vests fail. Ahhhhh yes the sweet taste of low price with a hint of bitter buyers remorse.*chuckles*
What gear/weapon selections do you use? Inform us "non-informed" types on this forum.

KellyTTE:
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Despite what you might think, I'm no Glock kool-ade drinker. If I had the funds, I'd be converting to S&W M&P9s. I consider them to be a 'product improved' platform.
9mm? Really? Figured since you seem "in the loop" tactically, you'd be choosing a caliber that has a better track record. Maybe a .40 S&W, or a .45 ACP?. What about 10mm? Your choice in the end, though. Why don't you try the Ruger SR9? Same capacity as the MP9, and it's a little cheaper on the wallet. Just a thought.


P.S. I looked at your past qualifications on your website, and I now understand why you are displaying the holier than thou attitude. Do you display this with any students you may have instructed? You are not representing yourself well as a credible instructor by acting like a douche bag on this forum. How about you maintain some professionalism? Get you head out of your ***, and use this as an opportunity to teach someone, rather than being insulting.
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:24 AM   #8
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And this is exactly what I am talking about. You sound just exactly like every other Elite Team Fighter on the Internetz. Someone who thinks that only the gear he and his merry men have personally signed, sealed and approved is "worthy" to enter into Asgard and grace the very halls of Valhalla itself.
Unlike your mentioned example, I put my opinions out there in the light of day. No masks, no hidden agendas. I accept no advertising and most of the gear I get gets returned or donated.

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Great stuff, it would appear, but not a hell of a lot of it would actually fit into a standard US Military Soldier's budget, or the common working man for that matter.
You might be surprised what soldiers will buy for them selves. Yes there are 350.00 cases (UKi and higher end Hardiggs) but there are also entry level Hardigg cases (sub 150.00 online) as well as lots of good solid sub 50.00 gear, belts, gloves, etc, etc.

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But, I digress, I have an honest question - would you be willing to answer it truthfully in the open? Or would you prefer a PM?
I'll meet you half-way. PM me and so long as it doesn't violate my site internal policies regarding neutrality or pose a conflict of interest, we'll make it public.
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Old 10-25-2008, 01:42 AM   #9
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KellyTTE:
Why is his decision bad? XD is a perfectly good choice.
Too many failures in training, lack of readily available parts, SA suppressing aftermarket access to armorers manuals. Sorry, that doesn't add up to a 'good choice' to me and I'm not going to sugar coat the problems that I've seen with my own eyes.

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What gear/weapon selections do you use? Inform us "non-informed" types on this forum.
Honestly, most of my gear is custom made. The quality is outstanding and the cost is very reasonable. My slings are mostly John Willis (SOE Original gear > 30.00), my current war belts and plate carrier are David Bosen (Coyote Tactical), but I did purchase one Eagle plate carrier for a whopping 65.00 shipped.

With a few exceptions my rifles are ARs and almost all are Colt (bought used at a discount), LMT or Sabre (also carefully shopped for price). Quality can be very affordable. All my pistols are Glocks, 17/26/21, for training consistency excluding one custom 1911.

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9mm? Really? Figured since you seem "in the loop" tactically, you'd be choosing a caliber that has a better track record. Maybe a .40 S&W, or a .45 ACP?. What about 10mm?
Caliber discussions are dumb. In the end a lot of calibers have killed a lot of people.

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Why don't you try the Ruger SR9? Same capacity as the MP9, and it's a little cheaper on the wallet. Just a thought.
Horrible trigger, and even worse trigger reset. I was actually a P89 fan for many years, but the SR9 is an abomination.

Quote:
P.S. I looked at your past qualifications on your website, and I now understand why you are displaying the holier than thou attitude. Do you display this with any students you may have instructed? You are not representing yourself well as a credible instructor by acting like a douche bag on this forum. How about you maintain some professionalism? Get you head out of your ***, and use this as an opportunity to teach someone, rather than being insulting.
No where on my site do I claim to be any type of instructor. I hold training days where ANYONE can bring up a desired area that they want to work on and we ALL work on it together. Military, LE, Civilian. I'm not 'holier than thou' but I will call a spade a spade. If you give dumbed down advice, I'm going to call you out on it. But don't kill the messenger. If that offends you, then you might as well put me on ignore. You have every right to post what you think, but that doesn't earn you a pass when the information stinks to high heaven.
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Old 10-25-2008, 02:17 AM   #10
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KellyTTE:

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Horrible trigger, and even worse trigger reset. I was actually a P89 fan for many years, but the SR9 is an abomination.
The SR9 is actually a fine firearm in my opinion. Good accuracy, and can throw those 9mm pills out there (accurately) for quite a distance. Good ergonomics, and the 17+1 capacity is an outstanding feature. I don't think you can get better deal for around 450 dollars or less. I can't see how purchasing an MP9 is a good decision to me. Why waste your hard earned money on something that doesn't really offer anything different than the other products on the market? I think it would be smarter to take the 650-750 dollars or so that you would spend on a MP9, and buy an SR9, some extra magazines, maybe a nice tactical light, and some ammo/cleaning kits, or any other shooting related things you may want or need.

Since my opinion is different than yours, does that mean I'm uninformed?

KellyTTE:
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Caliber discussions are dumb. In the end a lot of calibers have killed a lot of people.
Caliber discussions are dumb, but basically calling someone stupid for making their own choice on a firearm for their own reasons is not?

Sorry if I seem harsh, but you ruined any credibility your website may have brought you by the stupid comment you made to iVTEC. Professional firearms reviewers/instructors do not talk down to other people because that person's reasoning may differ from the reviewer/instructor. Be a professional, and use that as an opportunity to maybe bestow some knowledge and mentorship on the forum.

KellyTTE:
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You have every right to post what you think, but that doesn't earn you a pass when the information stinks to high heaven.
KellyTTE:
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If you give dumbed down advice, I'm going to call you out on it.
How is your advice better? It all comes down to the same thing which is your opinion vs someone else's opinion. You believe the XD is not a smart purchase. I believe for the general public, it is a smart purchase. You have your reasons, I have my reasons. How is your opinion better than my opinion? Glocks can break down in training too. Big deal. So the aftermarket can't get an armorers manual from SA. Why would that matter to the regular person just wanting to buy an XD for basic home defense? Explain the failures the XD experienced in training, and how those failures are different than the failures experienced by other people with different types of firearms when performing the same type of training?

It's all opinion. Debating is great, and is a great way to learn from other people, but telling someone "you fail at this stage of life" is not acceptable in my opinion. Act your age...............
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