Originally Posted by John_Deer
The best self defense rounds pass through the body and would need to be dug out of something behind the attacker.
Police switched to the 357 mag during prohibition because it would penetrate car doors and still take out the bad guy. No 9mm HP round in production is going to penetrate a thin skinned car of today unless you make a miraculous shot and miss all the internal components of the door.
Berry's hollow points are known for not expanding. They are target ammo and not meant to expand. I have seen a man empty a pistol on the windshield of a Honda Accord loaded with berry's HP. The windshield was still intact. I demolished the windshield and the headrest I was aiming at with a single winchester ranger 124 gr FMJ. Imagine how anemic an expanding HP would be VS the car windshield.
I take all this into consideration because I live in a rural area. Most people around here are ex military and are going to shoot from behind cover. I don't expect to have a shoot out with my neighbors but I give any bad guy enough respect to be as well trained as we have been.
I have no clue what any of this has to do with the post that you quoted. But the standard litmus test for self defense rounds is the FBI Penetration Standard using the FBI Wound Ballistics Protocol. Rounds must penetrate a minumum of 12" and maximum of 18" in bare ballistic gelatin, and gelatin protected by barriers such as heavy clothing, steel, wallboard, plywood and 2 different auto glass tests.
If berrys HP (whatever that is) won't go through windshield glass then it won't pass the FBI Penetration Standards.
As far as your statement on penetration is concerned, over penetration is a problem in an urban environment. Which is why the FBI Penetration standard sets a minimum AND maximum depth.
Regarding your comment on 9mm rounds, your information is incorrect. We fired some rounds into an old school BRICK of a car door the other day. My buddy's 9mm JHP passed through the passenger side door arced up busted out the window on the other side and embedded itself DEEP in a tree. Our agencies tac teams shoot up cars with their battle rifles and handguns all the time. There's at least 2 impounded cars on the range every month just for them to shoot up. And a lot of them carry 9mms. They have no more and no less issues with 9mm than their team members have with their other handgun calibers. If 9mm rounds would not penetrate the thin metal of a car door they would not pass the steel phase of the protocol and would not meet the FBI penetration standard.