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Old 09-18-2011, 03:51 PM   #1
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Default 380 ACP through biker leather jacket

LCP 380 is my primary most carried weapon, but I want to, ney, I need to know what it can really do.

I've been looking all over youtube and searching google, but can't find any definitive test on shooting through leather.

A biker's thick leather jacket is a common enough item to possibly encounter. Will it stop a 380 enough to seriously reduce the effectiveness.

I've found quite a number of test videos...
1) through a slab of ribs and then into gel. Went through the ribs and then 6" into the gel (result = effective)
2) through 4 layers of denim and then into gel. On one test, the denim clogged the hollow point so it didn't expand. The clogged bullet acted like a regular flat nose FMJ and actually penetrated further because it didn't expand (result either way = effective)
3) through a light leather jacket into a water jug. This one didn't tell me anything other than a light leather jacket does nothing. I like the gel tests better because you get a more precise measurable result. (through a light leather jacket = effective)

Fine, plenty of videos showing the 380 as effective, but still doesn't answer my question.

Here's the test I want to see:
Thick leather jacket, then cotton sweatshirt, then slab of ribs, then gel.
I'm left guessing on whether the 380 would be effective through that. I'm sure it would go into the ribs, but if the ribs stop it, I would declare it uneffective.

Another must do test is a nice very think winter coat, then a sweatshirt, then some long-johns, then a slab of ribs, then gel.
Would it be effective into that or stop at the ribs? I don't know.

I'm left to guess if there are some situations where 380, even well placed into the chest could be uneffective because of common wear items. None of the tests I've found are adequate to answer for sure.

For now, it's LCP in the summer and LCR in the winter. I'd like know when for sure the LCP can be counted on though.

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Old 09-18-2011, 04:47 PM   #2
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this is the way testing should be done in my opinion. let us know if you find what your looking for.

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Old 09-18-2011, 10:30 PM   #3
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That would be a very interesting test. To be totally honest however, I think it would be a real strain on the little .380. What specific round are you looking for? A real problem I have encountered is issues related to barrel length. Even a half inch of barrel length could be the difference between good penetration and expansion or failure to expand.

A lot of good .45 ammo wont expand when shot through the Bersa Thunder UC45, but will with a compact Glock (difference of less than an inch in barrel length). So far, Speer Gold Dot has been a great performer is 3.5" barrels with reliable expansion.

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Old 09-18-2011, 10:53 PM   #4
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Your concern is why I'd never load anything but heavy-for-caliber non-expanding ammo (preferrably some type of flat-point). The caliber is already so strained to have bullets both reliably expand and reliably penetrate, I wouldn't want to count on it still doing both after penetrating any number of relatively common obstacles (like leather jackets).

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Old 09-19-2011, 03:11 AM   #5
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A test like that would be great reading!

But my first thought was why are you spending so much time in a biker bar?

my attempt at humor

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Old 09-19-2011, 03:34 AM   #6
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usually around here the biker clubs won't start trouble unless they seriously outnumber someone......so you're also gonna need alot more mags

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Old 09-19-2011, 04:13 AM   #7
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If it don't go through the jacket aim for the balls

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Old 09-19-2011, 10:48 AM   #8
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Default Alternate test procedure:

1 - Drive to biker bar.
2 - Back your truck over several bikes. (leave it running)
3 - Step out w/LCP in dominant hand.
4 - Aim for rapidly approaching leather jackets.
5 - Fire 1 round per test subject.
6 - Re-enter truck & drive to somewhere safe with internet access.
7 - Report findings here.

Suggested preparation: keep Bushmaster and/or Mini readily accessible during steps 3-6.

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Old 09-19-2011, 11:59 AM   #9
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The Hornady Critical Defense was made specifically to punch through material and still expand without clogging,I'd like to see how it does through leather.Ha ha,my buddy and I used to joke about smaller calibers and leather,for instance the .25acp,we'd joke it might do ok unless they were wearing a leather coat.

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Old 09-19-2011, 12:02 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjatoth View Post
The Hornady Critical Defense was made specifically to punch through material and still expand without clogging,I'd like to see how it does through leather.Ha ha,my buddy and I used to joke about smaller calibers and leather,for instance the .25acp,we'd joke it might do ok unless they were wearing a leather coat.
Only problem with HCD is related directly to barrel length. Its VERY unreliable out of sub-3" barrels with regard to expansion.
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