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Old 10-29-2013, 08:10 PM   #31
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Then how come as a cop when I get written a ticket (and it HAS happened) I end up having to go to court on it and pay it same as you? (Also HAS happened)
You're a cop. In some ways that makes you a pawn of the ruling class more than a part of it. I never said the cop and judge were members of the ruling class. Cops and judges aren't the ones who wrote the SAFE act and signed it into law.

Not all traffic courts are a complete joke, but many are. I've been to traffic courts where the judge is obviously using intimidation tactics and denying legitimate legal procedure. I've been in other traffic courts where I was amazed at how professional and by the book the judge and ADA were.

Either way, this guy in Lockport has every reason to plead not guilty.

Edit: It might also be worth noting that New York State police are exempt from the 7 round limit that this arrest was about. Not sure if people from other states are aware of that.
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Old 10-29-2013, 08:18 PM   #32
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JJ,

Another citizens Constitutional violation!
Wonder what wet behind the ears or puppet cop arrested him for that!
It would be a real simple decision if I were an officer in NY. I would not ask nor look to see how many rounds was in a magazine of a person who was carrying their weapon legally with a CCW. Screw the Governor as well as the City of NY! I would not be a puppet and cater to the bureaucratic machine of NY who violates our Constitutional Rights!

03
'03. There are plenty of LEos who do not agree with the "law" and do look the other way. One of which is the Sheriff in the county whee this incident happened. He has publicly stated that he wil not order his men to enforce the SAFE Act because of the fact that it violates the US Constitution. The guy running against him, is asking what else he is not enforcing because of this. Needless to say, I am watching this race with a great deal of interest.

And no, I do not live in his county. If I did, I already know who I would vote for.
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Old 10-29-2013, 09:22 PM   #33
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Edit: It might also be worth noting that New York State police are exempt from the 7 round limit that this arrest was about. Not sure if people from other states are aware of that.
Don't think I would have put that in green myself, being that it is true.

Not only the State Police, all LEOs are exempt from the provisions of this law regarding magazine capacity, 7 round limit, and "Assault Weapon" possesion. Ex-LEOs are covered as well if they stay UTD on their training, other wise it is time to register and get rid of the "Hi-Capacity Ammunition Feeding Devices" or Factory Magazines. The only things LEOs are not exempt from is the back ground checks for purchasing a firearm or ammunition.

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Old 10-30-2013, 03:16 AM   #34
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Since the driver of the car was the person accused of a crime, and the passenger was not breaking any other law, the officer had no call to count the number of rounds in the magazine. Grounds for dismissal: Unlawful search and seizure.
It's not that simple. There's a whole list of Supreme Court rulings involving vehicle searches and probable cause, including several different ones involving passengers and their property.

What we need here is not a search and seizure ruling. That will prevent if from going to the Supreme Court under the NY law because there is already existing case law for passenger searches.

What we need is for it to go to the Supreme Court with the argument that the law itself is a violation of the 2nd ammendment.
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Old 10-30-2013, 04:38 AM   #35
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It's not that simple. There's a whole list of Supreme Court rulings involving vehicle searches and probable cause, including several different ones involving passengers and their property.

What we need here is not a search and seizure ruling. That will prevent if from going to the Supreme Court under the NY law because there is already existing case law for passenger searches.

What we need is for it to go to the Supreme Court with the argument that the law itself is a violation of the 2nd ammendment.
I agree with you on that Delta. Case law is quite complicated, and it is and has been, a game changer in the past. The SAFE Act is not just a violation of the 2A though. It also violates the 4th and 5th Amendments. Personally it makes no difference to me if the SAFE Act is repealed over the 2A or another amendment. Whatever it gets thrown out over is good enough for me. I would take it getting thrown out by NY's Congress holding another vote if that happened, the end result is the same.

Not argueing with you, I was just pointing out one possible outcome to the case. Nothing more, nothing less. My only point is that if the passenger was not breaking a law, riding with an idiot is still legal last time I checked, by the handbook that the NYSP released there was no call for the officer in question to count rounds in the magazine. Within said handbook, it clearly states that doing so without probable cause is grounds for a dismissal in court. Since the DA presented the case to the grand jury, and they voted to proceed, if there is a conviction it will be appealed and it may eventually lead to it being decided on by the Supreme Court. All I was saying is that a good attourney stands a good chance of getting a not guilty verdict or a dismissal if the "book" on these laws is brought into evidence. If it was me would it be my whole case? No.Is it enough to alter the outcome and the end decision? yes.

As the grandson of a 22 year veteran of the NYSP, and a former criminal justice student, I have the utmost respect for those who enforce our laws, and keep us safe. Even when said LEO does not follow proper procedure, I still respect the badge and what it stands for. We as a species are not perfect, and mistakes will be made, this does not diminish any LEO in my eyes. However, the LEO in this case made a mistake, and it is a big enough one to cause a dismissal in this case. Add to that the public opinion of the Unsafe act, I honestly do not see this going to a higher court. Jury selection should be very entertaining to say the least.
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Old 10-30-2013, 05:19 AM   #36
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http://www.fsbotupelo.com/1201ClaytonAve.html Not my style, but how much would it cost in NYS ($237,000 in Tupelo, MS)?
That house would easily go for 10 times that amount in my neighborhood. probably quite a bit more. The house I am now in is 750 square feet (a teardown in this neighborhood) on a large lot. We could easily get $2 million for the dirt.
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:50 AM   #37
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That house would easily go for 10 times that amount in my neighborhood. probably quite a bit more. The house I am now in is 750 square feet (a teardown in this neighborhood) on a large lot. We could easily get $2 million for the dirt.
At least! Thats a high 6 to low 7 figure home on Long Island or Westchester....and at least 350-400K here,...
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:53 AM   #38
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That house would easily go for 10 times that amount in my neighborhood. probably quite a bit more. The house I am now in is 750 square feet (a teardown in this neighborhood) on a large lot. We could easily get $2 million for the dirt.
In Rural Upstate NY, it would go about 300K in that condition, the taxes would be about 5 to 7 K a year and the pool would be worthless 10 months a year! Im not sure Tupelo would be my first choice but Who Knows?

Ive already got the older and bigger version on about 8.5 acres of pure heaven in upstate. We paid 62K for it when we bought it 12 years ago, lots of work later and its valued nearly at the price they listed the Tupelo One for!


As for the guy who's real only mistake was riding with a lady who was going 14 mph over the speedlimit, I have no clue what the probable cause for searching the guy, the car and molesting the handgun were. Because its not far from here were hearing about it lots and nothing I am hearing indicates the man was suspect in anything but riding in a car that was going faster than it should have been going.

The Officer asked them if they had any weapons in the vehicle, why? He admitted he did, showed his permit but the LEO went even Further Why? after he was released from jail the Judge who issued the permit recalled it and all his weapons, Why? They took his 5 legal Pistols and some long guns and his permit because he got caught with a preban load in his pistol, thats ridiculous!

If "riding in a car with someone who is suspected of speeding" is probable cause for searching and molesting private citizens and their property that are not suspected of a crime, were all in trouble! I have to believe that he will have lots of folks helping him with his defense fund, this and a few others are the kind of little things that can become landmark cases easily.

I know lots of non New Yorkers are laughing and chortling at this sh!t but they really need to think a little before they chide us for staying here and fighting the monster. I think you would do the same in your state if it happened to you, I would be the first one to encourage you to not give up and try to help you with your fight.

The Ive got mine thing is whats getting our entire nation in a world of Sh!t. This isnt a subject just for NYers, Republicans or Conservatives, it effects everyone. If its allowed to stand in NY, sooner or later it will come to your state also!

So what can you do as a pro 2a US Citizen to make a diff other than your yearly NRA Donations?

A- We have lots of hunting, fishing and trapping upstate that brings in lots of out of state folks that arent lucky enough to have the Garden of Eden in their Backyard. Write an Email to our leaders in Albany and Washington and tell them you wont even drive through the state as long as the Unsafe Act is upheld

B- Dont buy anything made in this state, Boycott all NY Products and write the manufacturers any tell them why your not buying their products. Remington is a good starter but if your brokerage is in NYC, cut them off as well.

C- When Andy Coumo starts his push for Federal office, you better fight him off from your state otherwise President Coumo will take your guns just as fast as Governor Coumo took ours!

Literally millions of folks have left NY and come to your states because of Taxes, Regulations and stagnation caused by decades of Progressive and Nanny State BS. Those left here are the ones who gained ground via wealth redistribution. Many are psychos, disabled and poor shipped in from other states and countries that offer nothing but a one way ticket to NY. Still others are the extremely wealthy who hid everything they had out of state except their Summer homes.

The rest of us are Real New Yorkers that have been standing our ground since the very beginning. Support us, dont sucker punch us or we will continue to ship as many of our progressives to your states as we can! Allowing NY to go Socialist will only cause you to have allot of transplants that will bring some NY Politics with them to your home town!
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:27 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by WebleyFosbery38

In Rural Upstate NY, it would go about 300K in that condition, the taxes would be about 5 to 7 K a year and the pool would be worthless 10 months a year! Im not sure Tupelo would be my first choice but Who Knows?

Ive already got the older and bigger version on about 8.5 acres of pure heaven in upstate. We paid 62K for it when we bought it 12 years ago, lots of work later and its valued nearly at the price they listed the Tupelo One for!

As for the guy who's real only mistake was riding with a lady who was going 14 mph over the speedlimit, I have no clue what the probable cause for searching the guy, the car and molesting the handgun were. Because its not far from here were hearing about it lots and nothing I am hearing indicates the man was suspect in anything but riding in a car that was going faster than it should have been going.

The Officer asked them if they had any weapons in the vehicle, why? He admitted he did, showed his permit but the LEO went even Further Why? after he was released from jail the Judge who issued the permit recalled it and all his weapons, Why? They took his 5 legal Pistols and some long guns and his permit because he got caught with a preban load in his pistol, thats ridiculous!

If "riding in a car with someone who is suspected of speeding" is probable cause for searching and molesting private citizens and their property that are not suspected of a crime, were all in trouble! I have to believe that he will have lots of folks helping him with his defense fund, this and a few others are the kind of little things that can become landmark cases easily.

I know lots of non New Yorkers are laughing and chortling at this sh!t but they really need to think a little before they chide us for staying here and fighting the monster. I think you would do the same in your state if it happened to you, I would be the first one to encourage you to not give up and try to help you with your fight.

The Ive got mine thing is whats getting our entire nation in a world of Sh!t. This isnt a subject just for NYers, Republicans or Conservatives, it effects everyone. If its allowed to stand in NY, sooner or later it will come to your state also!

So what can you do as a pro 2a US Citizen to make a diff other than your yearly NRA Donations?

A- We have lots of hunting, fishing and trapping upstate that brings in lots of out of state folks that arent lucky enough to have the Garden of Eden in their Backyard. Write an Email to our leaders in Albany and Washington and tell them you wont even drive through the state as long as the Unsafe Act is upheld

B- Dont buy anything made in this state, Boycott all NY Products and write the manufacturers any tell them why your not buying their products. Remington is a good starter but if your brokerage is in NYC, cut them off as well.

C- When Andy Coumo starts his push for Federal office, you better fight him off from your state otherwise President Coumo will take your guns just as fast as Governor Coumo took ours!

Literally millions of folks have left NY and come to your states because of Taxes, Regulations and stagnation caused by decades of Progressive and Nanny State BS. Those left here are the ones who gained ground via wealth redistribution. Many are psychos, disabled and poor shipped in from other states and countries that offer nothing but a one way ticket to NY. Still others are the extremely wealthy who hid everything they had out of state except their Summer homes.

The rest of us are Real New Yorkers that have been standing our ground since the very beginning. Support us, dont sucker punch us or we will continue to ship as many of our progressives to your states as we can! Allowing NY to go Socialist will only cause you to have allot of transplants that will bring some NY Politics with them to your home town!
I so believed in the "Stand & Fight" posture for a long time, even considered a College Job In Vermont several years ago(@ Middlebury College as an asst. Football Coach & Hist. Prof.) that would have allowed me to live Across the river In Upstate NY...
When I looked at my Pension and how much it was really worth, We finally decided that we have to get out here to be able to live on my pension alone....I WILL do everything I can to Keep Cuomo Jr. out....Esp. since he is the Opposite of his DAD......
BTW,..My Friend in Smithtown (L.I.) pays $11,600 in Taxes per year...we were paying about $3,800 In Hicksville(Town Of Oyster Bay) now we pay less then $1100 a Year!!..
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:52 PM   #40
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Webley, We have been fighting the same fight on the Left Coast for years and I frequently hear the suggestion that I quit and run to another state.

I am not a quitter, any more than you are, and I doubt that those who suggest we do so would not consider it if it were their own state. You have hit the nail right on the head.
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