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Old 11-06-2012, 02:38 PM   #191
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Scenerio..........Statistition......And your chances of winning the lotto.....

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Old 11-06-2012, 09:10 PM   #192
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caliber....22

cartridge.....9x18

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Old 11-06-2012, 11:46 PM   #193
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This post was just begging for rulers and indecent exposure.

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Old 11-07-2012, 01:32 AM   #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocketgeezer View Post
I have a honest question have ANY of you 25 supporters ever even shot one, or did any testing to see what sort of damage it MAY do? bacause if you have you would definatly not be posting on here supporting it, while its true any gun is better than none at all, and most 25s are small and very concealable, so are the 22s and a 22 loaded with a good hot rd would be a much better defensive weapon, so I guess if you have had one given to you great, and if you like it, good for you, but if you buy one bad on you, you would be better off with a 22
If you had actually tested a 25ACP, you might just be surprised at

the damage it can do. (YES, I have.) Once again, for me, it's the

crappy 2" barrel, which gets super inaccurate at over 10 feet, and

the hand-cutting slide, which put me off...
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:48 PM   #195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRau View Post
This is not a bad choice, but to say the bullet is larger than a 9 is silly, .002 (.355 verses .357)!
And if you shot 9mm +p+ there is VERY little difference. The Winchester 127 +p+ goes 1285 fps (out of three different guns of mine) so you don't gain much by going to the 357 Sig. Both are basically 357 Mag ballistics (125 gr/127 gr bullet at 1250 to 1400 fps). The good thing is that several platforms are available in 40 and with a simple bbl change you can go to 357 Sig.
OK, I was referring to standard weight of the bullet with standard loads. Without splitting hairs, the .357 Sig and 9mm are essentially the same size and almost the same weight. As to heavy and +P loads, I don't consider anything I can't buy at Walmart on the way out of town as a practical self defense round.

Standard 9mm is 115gr, 1180fps muzzle velocity, 356 ft/lbs muzzle energy*

Standard .357Sig is 125 gr, 1350fps, 506 ft/lbs*

I'm not really sold on .357Sig yet, but on paper it looks pretty good. I'd like to know how it actually performs and how it feels. The other side of the muzzle energy coin is recoil. There are a couple of physical laws at work here. 506ft/lb out the front pushing back on a 21.5oz Glock 32 is significant. In comparison, .45ACP 165gr JHP generates 412ft/lb* of muzzle energy, and against my 39oz Colt 1911 is not at all a problem.

As I ponder what to buy as my first post-election panic gun purchase, the arthritis that makes the heavy 5" Colt harder to draw from an IWB holster, is making lightweight guns more attractive, although the "pea shooter is better than nothing" philosophy doesn't make sense to me. That's how I came to study the mid-size Glocks (G19, 23, 32, 38) and stumbled across the .357Sig. I carried a G19 for several years, but in a fit of stupidity I sold it--it's still the best all-around pistol, if you're only going to have one gun.

Clearly the designation ".357" is a marketing ploy, as the round is essentially a .40 cartridge necked down to 9mm. Sig-Sauer decided to associate the round with .357 Magnum rather than call it something like "9mm Bombig".

* Source: Federal Premium Ammunition, Standard JHP rounds.
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Old 11-07-2012, 05:51 PM   #196
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The energy numbers are very misleading and MANY people put WAY to much weight on them. They are just one of MANY variables.

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Old 11-07-2012, 06:23 PM   #197
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9mm is the smallest that I'm comfy with.

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Old 11-07-2012, 10:21 PM   #198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by therewolf

If you had actually tested a 25ACP, you might just be surprised at

the damage it can do. (YES, I have.) Once again, for me, it's the

crappy 2" barrel, which gets super inaccurate at over 10 feet, and

the hand-cutting slide, which put me off...
I had an awesome Raven MP25 I gave to a buddy because I didn't like buying the expensive ammo for a single gun I rarely shot. It had way more penetration and "oompf" than a 22lr from a handgun. There's a vid on youtube that shows a couple shooting a Jimenez 22 and Raven 25 at an old computer hard drive. The 22 just dinged it while the 25 blew clean through. As far as I'm concerned the 25 is a much more viable option for personal protection, when compared to a 22lr. Though as I stated before, I confidently trust a 22 for my personal protection, along with my ability to read situations, apply maneuvers and defend both mentally and physically in a situation that might call for such actions.
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Old 11-08-2012, 12:40 PM   #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRau View Post
The energy numbers are very misleading and MANY people put WAY to much weight on them. They are just one of MANY variables.
Could you elaborate on that statement? Muzzle Energy is a calculated number based on muzzle velocity and bullet weight. I was under the impression that ME was what makes the 55gr 5.56mm AR round (1325 ft.lb.) so destructive compared to a less powerful round of the same or even greater weight.

Before I jump in and spend $550 on another handgun and have to add another round to my ammo inventory, I'd like to research the other variables to which you refer. I mean the variables that don't apply equally to most rounds. For example, bullet type is a variable, but most rounds will be available in the same variety of FMJ and JHP bullets. And again, please reference ordinary OTC rounds, as I don't load and am not likely to start.

Thanks for the advice.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:02 PM   #200
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I've carried a .32 Beretta loaded with Glasers before but was never particularly happy about it. Fortunately, 9mm subcompacts are not much larger than the 3032 Tomcat nowadays and it is usually left in the safe.

About the smallest I carry now is a Ruger LC9. More often than not, it is acting as a backup for a 1911, Combat Commander, Sig P220, Glock 21, Glock 23 or Beretta PX4 but I have carried it with nothing else on quite a few occasions. I suppose I could carry the .32 or get a Ruger LCP to backup the LC9.

Actually, the pic shows my usual carry rig. I am uncomfortable going out with anything less.

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