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Old 10-22-2013, 10:17 PM   #11
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Oh, and for the record, I support the right for open carry, and may choose to do so under some circumstances. Just pointing out some premises that may not fully support the overall argument.
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Old 10-22-2013, 10:20 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by activereality
No matter the carry style a person subscribes to, they will believe in it. And if people don't believe in something, most people will justify the act of condemning it. Personally, I do both as well. It's my belief and it also depends on my mood that day. Naysayers will always creep out and quote the anything and everything- even doctrine from outdated texts or manuals.

The truth is( again my opinion) that there is no right or wrong answer. With the possible exception of carrying at all being my accepted "more correct" method of self defense.

To all who subscribe to one way over the other, for whatever your reasons may be, good on you. There are too many who simply subsist and comply. The easy way is not the only way. Lol.

I agree we are all different. I agree your method is different than mine. I carry for self defense. If you do not, please forward all of our shooting equipment to the below address hehe.

Nice post and a good read man.
I wasn't condemning the practice. I do not have an issue with open carry. I do however have an issue with the post seeming to have a dont mess with me i have a gun on my hip type attitude. I'm not saying that was the way it was meant, but merely my perception of it.
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Old 10-22-2013, 10:31 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by ctshooter
I wasn't condemning the practice. I do not have an issue with open carry. I do however have an issue with the post seeming to have a dont mess with me i have a gun on my hip type attitude. I'm not saying that was the way it was meant, but merely my perception of it.
Ct. Want to keep this friendly. I was not making any attempt at an attack on someone. That is my opinion of his opinion. Sometimes people's ideology differs. Sometimes not.

I agree it might come off a bit strong. I don't think he had that intent when he drafted that post though. However, as a constructive method of conversation. My rebuttal would be that it is funny how often there are those who believe In One Way and one way only. To the exclusion an attack of all else. I don't agree with this and don't subscribe to it.

I guess an example would be, I don't prefer to wear bright pink shirts to work. Some do. I do t hate them or attack them for it. But I won't be joining in lol.
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Old 10-22-2013, 10:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by activereality

Ct. Want to keep this friendly. I was not making any attempt at an attack on someone. That is my opinion of his opinion. Sometimes people's ideology differs. Sometimes not.

I agree it might come off a bit strong. I don't think he had that intent when he drafted that post though. However, as a constructive method of conversation. My rebuttal would be that it is funny how often there are those who believe In One Way and one way only. To the exclusion an attack of all else. I don't agree with this and don't subscribe to it.

I guess an example would be, I don't prefer to wear bright pink shirts to work. Some do. I do t hate them or attack them for it. But I won't be joining in lol.
I did not take it as an attack. All is good. Was more just trying to clarify my responses to the posts in general.

That is one thing I dislike about things like texting and such. So damn hard to tell how it is meant.
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Old 10-22-2013, 11:11 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by ctshooter
I did not take it as an attack. All is good. Was more just trying to clarify my responses to the posts in general. That is one thing I dislike about things like texting and such. So damn hard to tell how it is meant.

Yeah. No "tone" enabled script.
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:38 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by SSGN_Doc View Post
Here is a case that started wheree a permit holder was open carrying, had his gun stolen, and he was killed in a convenience store. Then other killings were committed with his gun. Guess Premise number one is not true.

http://www.timesdispatch.com/news/teen-homicide-suspects-have-criminal-histories/article_970e24e7-dd5d-57e7-8fb8-a64a0a2b26ba.html
The OCer was not targeted, it was a theft of opportunity because the OCer was not maintaining a situational awareness because his arms were extended reaching for a product and he allowed a teenager access to his gun. But his biggest mistake was chasing the kid knowing that the kid had his gun and that a bullet was chambered. Using this as a typical incident of guns being taken from OCers is a red herring. It's a reminder to OCers to always maintain situational awareness. Not chasing a guy who is carrying a loaded gun is a no-brainer.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:11 PM   #17
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Default Yes, check the other forum, I did respond.

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I hope you get the response you want on this forum you didn't get on other forum you posted it on. I think they are still waiting for you to answer the questions they put to you on the other forum that you were going to get back to them with.
I did respond to the challenge on the other forum, and I see that you too post on other forums. We all do.

I will respond similarly on this thread to a post of a similar question. Open Carry vs Concealed Carry is a topic that needs to be addressed on as many forums as possible because there are "trolls" from the left who invade conservative forums, pretending to be conservative and then work their magic on dividing forums from within by posting red herring topics.

We must not put restrictions on the legal carrying of guns. Suggesting situational awareness issues and training issues and when and where not to Open Carry are the purpose of the post, but we must not apply the unwise actions of a few to be attributed to the entire Open Carry community in a way that the anti-gunners attributed the Sandy Hook shooting to guns in general. Tools of the left should be recognized for what they are and avoided entirely and civil discourse is what should take place among patriots of the 2nd Amendment.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:14 PM   #18
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OK proceed to cite EVERY study and what criteria they used to arrive at their conclusion.

You do make some good arguments but leading with anything that is an absolute is usually dangerous in a debate.

And I'll be waiting for the references still.
Criminals avoid armed citizens

In a survey of criminals(read that as FELONS IN PRISON), Professors James D. Wright and Peter Rossi of the Social and Demographic Research Institute at the University of Massachusetts conducted a study in 1982 and 1983 paid for by the U.S. Department of Justice. (Professor Rossi was a former President of the American Sociological Association.) The researchers interviewed 1,874 imprisoned felons in ten states.

88% of the criminals surveyed by Wright and Rossi agreed with the statement that, “A criminal who wants a handgun is going to get one.”(read this to mean that these felons are not obeying the gun laws and the Legislature cannot figure this out)

Wright and Rossi reported that:

81% of interviewees agreed that a “smart criminal” will try to determine if a potential victim is armed.

74% indicated that burglars avoided occupied dwellings, because of fear of being shot.

57% said that most criminals feared armed citizens more than the police.

40% of the felons said that they had been deterred from committing a particular crime, because they believed that the potential victim was armed.

57% of the felons who had used guns themselves said that they had encountered potential victims who were armed.

34% of the criminal respondents said that they had been scared off, shot at, wounded, or captured by an armed citizen.

Based on this government-funded research by Wright and Rossi, it would appear to a reasonable and prudent man that armed citizens do have a deterrent effect on crime.

Studies that found that armed citizens reduce violent crime
Lott and Mustard, Journal of Legal Studies, 1997
Bartley and Cohen, Economic Enquiry, 1998
Lott, Journal of Legal Studies, 1998
Bartley, Economic Letters, 1999
Benson and Mast, Journal of Law and Economics, 2001
Moody, Journal of Law and Economics, 2001
Marvel, Journal of Law and Economics, 2001
Lott and Whitley, Journal of Law and Economics, 2001
Lott and Whitley, Journal of Law and Economics, 2003
Helland and Tabarrok, Advances in Economic Analysis and Policy, 2004
Wilson, National Academies Press, 2005
Lott and Whitley, Economic Enquiry, 2007
Moody and Marvel, Econ Watch, 2008
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:23 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by ctshooter View Post
If it is kryptonite to the bad guys then why would you not carry open in a high crime rate area??

Seems like you want to portray the Barney Bad A$$ attitude when you are in your comfort zone, but timid and not wanting confrontation if in a sketchy area.
Seriously? Have you ever walked through the hood? I was a private investigator and process server in Washington DC and walked through groups of bad guys on their turf almost daily where I was warned my them, "You'd better be walking sideways here". You don't challenge the BG's place of dominion. They take it as an insult to their dominance. You might make it for a block or two, but those 10 and 11 year old punks looking or creds would kill you and then take your gun. All Open Carriers should use "Wisdom & Prudence" before deciding whether to OC or CC.

There are very few places safe from criminal attacks, that is why we all carry. There were 17,523 crimes against persons in Idaho in 2012, but of those 17,523 Idaho victims, I doubt that any of them were OCers.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:28 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by kfox75 View Post
A sheep dog is far harder for a wolf to spot than a rancher with a rifle.
That is why I love being a "rancher with a rifle."
It keeps the wolves away (unless they are mentally ill or drug crazed).
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