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-   -   North American Arms Rusting Problem (http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f14/north-american-arms-rusting-problem-2578/)

1geo 11-09-2007 11:04 PM

North American Arms Rusting Problem
 
Two years ago I purchased a NAA Black Widow .22 mag. I carry the weapon in a gun pouch, a protected environment. Upon inspecting it a few days ago I was shocked to find the barrel rusting. This gun is supposedly made of a high quality stainless steel. I'm 69 years old and am a retired Senior Reactor Systems Engineer. I have had a life time of experience with stainless steel. The only way stainless rusts in a protected environment is if it contains impurities and the NAA weapon I have has a LOT of impurities. Has anyone else had similar experiences with NAA weapons?

Dgunsmith 11-10-2007 02:54 PM

Stainless RUSTS !
 
All currently manufactured Stainless Steel firearms WILL Rust !

The original S&W 66's that were marine grade stainless won't rust but they quit using those materials long ago as it is too hard on machine tooling used to manufacture them.

To eliminate rust on stainless...have it coated with a modern finish, such as Bear Coat ...takes away the shine and eliminates rust.
www.bearcoat.com

wiping stainless down with birchwood-Casey SHEATH or Militec will slow, but not eliminate the rust issue.

Hunting rifles in stainless glint in the sunlight and can be seen for miles by game. We have seen new browning SS rifles come back from Alaska completely rusted over. As one outfitter in Alaska said...the only thing that doesnt rust in Alaska....is rope....and it rots !

1geo 11-10-2007 10:48 PM

NAA Rusting Problem
 
As for "stainless" steel, the name stainless means it is not easily stained, i.e., it remains bright and shiny. The word has nothing to do with rusting. Stainless Steel is a common name for metal alloys that consist of 10.5% or more Chromium (Cr) and more than 50% Iron (Fe). Although it is called "stainless", a better term for it is "highly stain resistant", i.e., its difficult to STAIN stainless steel. The chromium content in stainless steel alloys is what generally prevents corrosion. Pure iron, the primary element of stainless steel, is extracted from its natural state as iron ore, it is unstable by itself, and naturally wants to corrode (rust). The chromium helps to procrastinate nature's attempts to combine the pure iron with oxygen and water to form rust. The chromium works by reacting with oxygen to form a tough, adherent, invisible, passive layer of chromium oxide film on the steel surface. If damaged mechanically or chemically, this film is self healing as long as it has enough oxygen. Simply put, unless THERE ARE IMPURITIES IN YOU PRODUCT, your guns should not rust in a protected environment. You stick with NAA, I'll spend my money elsewhere.

nativecajun 07-14-2008 09:53 PM

Stain "Less" steel. Not stain proof
 
If a gun of any type of metal is stored in a leather pouch it will rust. Some of the best stainless steels rust if not stored properly unless you are talking cheap butter knives. Leather retains mositure thus passing it on to the stored item. I imagine "but do not know for sure" that the barrel is made of a steel closer to ordonance steel for durability. Either that or a much more carbide content in the stainless steel for the barrel. But if you are going to store anything for a long time do not store it in leather.

This must be a collectors item you have. But you did say you were carring it. I cannot imagine a barrel rusting on the inside when it is being practiced with as it should be. If a gun would be made of a stainless steel that requires no care what so ever it would be to soft a steel to shoot with. Most cheap Swords shine forever but you can bend them like taffy.

Daniel







Quote:

Originally Posted by 1geo (Post 11677)
Two years ago I purchased a NAA Black Widow .22 mag. I carry the weapon in a gun pouch, a protected environment. Upon inspecting it a few days ago I was shocked to find the barrel rusting. This gun is supposedly made of a high quality stainless steel. I'm 69 years old and am a retired Senior Reactor Systems Engineer. I have had a life time of experience with stainless steel. The only way stainless rusts in a protected environment is if it contains impurities and the NAA weapon I have has a LOT of impurities. Has anyone else had similar experiences with NAA weapons?


nativecajun 07-14-2008 10:12 PM

Best quality extra small revolver made.
 
For those that want to be critical of one of the best and safest revolvers made in it's catagory read this link. Independant testing of NAA products.

http://www.naaminis.com/hpwhite.pdf



Quote:

Originally Posted by 1geo (Post 11706)
As for "stainless" steel, the name stainless means it is not easily stained, i.e., it remains bright and shiny. The word has nothing to do with rusting. Stainless Steel is a common name for metal alloys that consist of 10.5% or more Chromium (Cr) and more than 50% Iron (Fe). Although it is called "stainless", a better term for it is "highly stain resistant", i.e., its difficult to STAIN stainless steel. The chromium content in stainless steel alloys is what generally prevents corrosion. Pure iron, the primary element of stainless steel, is extracted from its natural state as iron ore, it is unstable by itself, and naturally wants to corrode (rust). The chromium helps to procrastinate nature's attempts to combine the pure iron with oxygen and water to form rust. The chromium works by reacting with oxygen to form a tough, adherent, invisible, passive layer of chromium oxide film on the steel surface. If damaged mechanically or chemically, this film is self healing as long as it has enough oxygen. Simply put, unless THERE ARE IMPURITIES IN YOU PRODUCT, your guns should not rust in a protected environment. You stick with NAA, I'll spend my money elsewhere.


billdeserthills 07-25-2008 06:33 AM

I have the same problem with a Para-Ordnance P-10 .45 that I carry in my pocket. It just shows that you are way behind in re-treating the leather you are storing the gun in. I like to use sno-seal conditioner, but I think most leather conditioners are the same. I find I get the best results if I let the holster air out a couple of days, then I like to put it in my toaster oven till warm to the touch, then rub in the leather conditioner, it should melt like butter and will quickly soak into your holster. Set your holster down for 24 hours and give it a wipe before using it again.
My sweat is so harsh I even ruined the finish on my $2,000.00 STI Edge the first summer I carried it. I have learned the hard way that leather needs some attention a few times a year, now I look at my gun at least once a week to be sure it doesn't have any moisture on it.

ccr 07-27-2008 02:25 PM

I have seen this problem with many Stainless guns mostly with Para's . I have not seen this on any NAA

RL357Mag 07-27-2008 07:34 PM

Stainless steel will delay the formation of rust, not prevent it. Oiled once a year it will probably never rust, but when in contact with ANYTHING porous for prolonged periods it will rust. Stored guns should be oiled at least once a year and never stored in contact with foam, leather, cardboard, paper, or other metals (galvanic action). Condensation will form even in a sealed container, that's why long term storage involves submersing in oil or coating with grease or cosmoline.

matt g 07-27-2008 11:41 PM

There are several types of stainless. Inexpensive, ferritic, stainless steels are just barely stainless and will rust up pretty quick. Expensive Austinitic, or surgical steels, are very rust and corrosion resistant but eat tooling and are difficult to weld.

There is a "mid-grade" option but it can be hard to select a suitable alloy. Generally, you either get 409 or 410 which is "low grade" ferritic stainless steels or "high grade" 316L or 312L.


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