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Old 07-30-2009, 10:58 AM   #21
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Whoever modded that m-79 to be a pistol must not realize those rounds don't arm until they've traveled approx 25 yds.
I think he did more harm than good, at least with a buttstock you can aim them fairly well.

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Old 08-12-2009, 11:14 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by OC357 View Post
Even the lowly .22 will kill you.
So can a BB gun and a sling shot. That doesn't make them or the .22 CONSISTENT and RELIABLE man-stoppers.

The only thing that matters when it comes to stops is PER CAPITA stop rates, which the .22 advocates conveniently ignore.

Statements like "The .22 has killed more people than the .45, thus the .22 is the superior man-stopper" is ludicrous, since the .22 may have been involved in TWENTY times as many shootings.

.45's that stop 95 out of a hundred attackers dead in their tracks, have a much higher PER CAPITA stop rate than .22's that stop 200 out of 2000 attackers.

That's a 95% stop rate compared to a 10% stop rate. I don't think I have to explain why I would go with the former in a life-or-death situation.

If the .22 was such a "deadly man-stopper", every law enforcement organization and military unit on the planet would be packing it.

They could carry considerably more rounds in their pistols, on their persons and in their vehicles. No more budget problems when it came to ammo---probably nothing is cheaper and more plentiful than the .22.

Problem is, it SUCKS when it comes to reliably stopping attackers.

Can't you just imagine some butterbar lieutenant telling a group of Special Forces soldiers---"Hey guys, internet experts have shown us that the .22 is a deadly man-stopper, thus we're only going to issue you handguns and rifles that fire the .22."

Yeah, right!
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:36 PM   #23
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.....any round that strikes a vital organ potentially will kill a human being regardless of caliber.

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Old 08-12-2009, 12:40 PM   #24
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The .22 LR was used for Special operations, it was equipped with a silencer.

Modern Firearms - Handguns - High Standard (Hi-Standard) HDM OSS silenced pistol

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Old 08-12-2009, 03:22 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defender View Post
So can a BB gun and a sling shot. That doesn't make them or the .22 CONSISTENT and RELIABLE man-stoppers.
You mis-interpreted what I said. All I said was "even the lowly .22 will kill you". I didn't say or even infer that it was a consistant and reliable or preferred man-killer round. I didn't put it in the same class as the other potent calibers mentioned. I was really referring to shot placement and perhaps I was not clear. All I am saying is.... it is not a "toy" round to be scoffed at, and it can kill you.

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Old 08-12-2009, 03:46 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defender View Post
Can't you just imagine some butterbar lieutenant telling a group of Special Forces soldiers---"Hey guys, internet experts have shown us that the .22 is a deadly man-stopper, thus we're only going to issue you handguns and rifles that fire the .22." Yeah, right!
Ahh....yes I can imagine, and it has been done and proven lethal many times, but not on orders by a butterbar lieutenant, by an A-Team 180A Executive Warrant Officer and issued by a 18B Weapons NCO Sergeant to the rest of his team members.

Intelligence agencies and military special forces have used suppressed 22 LR pistols for assassinations and for eliminating guard dogs or sentries. They are still used in SOG teams in South America and Afghanistan today. Some examples include the use of suppressed High Standard HDM pistols by the American OSS, which was the predecessor organization of the CIA. Gary Powers was issued a suppressed High Standard for the flight in which he was shot down. Suppressed Ruger MK II pistols are in current use by the US Navy SEALs.

The .22 LR has also seen limited usage by police and military snipers. Its main advantage in this role is its low noise, but it is usually limited to urban operations because of its short range. One weapon designed for this purpose is the Russian SV-99 rifle.

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The .22 LR was used for Special operations, it was equipped with a silencer.

Modern Firearms - Handguns - High Standard (Hi-Standard) HDM OSS silenced pistol
Thank you.


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Old 08-12-2009, 04:51 PM   #27
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While it is correct that a 40mm HE grenade must travel a minimum distance to arm,........... there's always the buckshot round!

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Old 08-12-2009, 05:12 PM   #28
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There is a new round out.

The 575 Super Ultra Coffin Kicker Incendary Tracking Round

or

The 575 suckit

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Old 08-12-2009, 07:53 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpttango30 View Post
There is a new round out.

The 575 Super Ultra Coffin Kicker Incendary Tracking Round

or

The 575 suckit
That certainly beats my .516 BlowMe

JD
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Old 08-12-2009, 09:17 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c3shooter View Post
While it is correct that a 40mm HE grenade must travel a minimum distance to arm,........... there's always the buckshot round!
Yeah you're right, and the Flechette round, wow talk about home defense!!

Sorry about bringing up the Military Silenced 22, I just thought it would be an interesting sidenote to the conversation. I didn't mean to stir things up.
Personally, I prefer one of the calibers starting with a 4, or 12 ga. with the suitable shot size, indoors, #2. In a rural setting, OO Buck.
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