Looking for a biometric pistol safe...any suggestions?
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Old 03-28-2010, 02:19 AM   #1
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Default Looking for a biometric pistol safe...any suggestions?

Hey everybody,

I am still waiting for my Sig to come in. I ordered the SCT and Sig is not so swift in the return phone call business recently, I guess. Anyway, like most of you I would like to keep my pistol loaded and accessible for immediate use, if necessary. I have my 6 year old son on the weekends, however, so I can't just leave it laying around. I was put on to this option by a friend of mine. Also, one of the owners at my local gun shop told me that it would keep the kid out, but not the neighbor. He said they were easy to pry open. I was looking to you pros to help me out here. Is this in fact my best option for the reasons I have stated? If so, which on is the best made version? If not, what other options allow me to have a weapon easily accessible and not an immediate threat to the welfare of my child. I am simply not risking that. However, having a trigger lock on the thing with it empty, does not really leave me ready to defend him or my home in the unfortunate event that something may happen. Just looking for some friendly advice really. I don't own any long guns, and I am renting, so I am not really looking for a vault just yet. Lets just leave that off the table for now. haha. Not very convenient. Thanks, in advance, for any and all advice you can provide.

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Old 03-28-2010, 03:26 AM   #2
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biometric fingerprint style safes are fine as long as you dont have mechanic hands like me. So many scars my fingers dont always register on the scanner.

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Old 03-28-2010, 08:07 AM   #3
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Biometric systems are not really safe.
There are tons of how to`s in the web, on how to fake fingerprints with normal household goods, that really work.

In my opinion, take a gun safe with an electronic pin keypad. They open pretty quick and you don`t have the problem mentioned by doctherock with cuty, burns, blisters and so on you fingers, that could make it hard for the bio reader to recognize the print.

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Old 03-28-2010, 08:25 AM   #4
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Biggest problem is what happens when the battery dies...do you have pry bars?
Next problem was mentioned, even a papercut interferes with the sensor, if you get dry hands, and they peel, your screwed.
I am thinking what you want is something like a cash lockbox, a lid with welded corners that lap over the box will be hard to pry. then lag bolt it to the floor (if carpeted) or to the wall in your closet (easily filled with caulk when you move) keep that key in your wallet so kid can't get it, and get a good trigger lock if your still worried. Remember to keep ammo in a separate location out of the child's reach, if you are really worried.
All small boxes are extremely easy to get into, but on the flip side most full size safes are easily defeated in 2 mins by 2 adult males with good prybars. The key to my plan is by securing the small box with the overlapping lid it takes more time to get a pry bar underneath, also if mounted in a good spot you virtually have to rip the wall/floor out just to get the right angle to pry it.

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Old 03-29-2010, 12:44 AM   #5
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Thanks guys. I appreciate all the input. I think maybe a keypad is a better option. I work construction. I will look at some good ones. Thanks again.

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Old 03-29-2010, 12:55 AM   #6
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glad to help....

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Old 03-31-2010, 06:19 AM   #7
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Try GunVault. You can get one with a key lock, finger code, or bio.


Gun Safe For The Home and Office | GunVault

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Old 04-05-2010, 09:39 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murfdeezy View Post
Thanks guys. I appreciate all the input. I think maybe a keypad is a better option. I work construction. I will look at some good ones. Thanks again.
How about one with a pushbutton lock? No batteries or electronics needed. Also made from 3/16" plate and weighs 21 lbs.
fas1-mount-options-039.jpg  
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Old 04-16-2010, 02:25 AM   #9
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Default Laymans Guide To Biometric Technology in Gun Safes

Here's a great link:

The Biometric Fingerprint Gun Safe - A Layman's Guide to Biometric Technology Used in Gun Safes

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Old 04-17-2010, 03:07 PM   #10
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That article didn't tell much other than the two kinds of technology being used. I'm sure that some are better than others, but how do you really know? Has the technology improved much since this article?

Here's another article if you are interested enough to read.

Howstuffworks



Below is an exert from that article:

Fun with Fingerprint Readers

Tsutomu Matsumoto, a Japanese cryptographer, recently decided to look at biometric fingerprint devices. These are security systems that attempt to identify people based on their fingerprint. For years the companies selling these devices have claimed that they are very secure, and that it is almost impossible to fool them into accepting a fake finger as genuine. Matsumoto, along with his students at the Yokohama National University, showed that they can be reliably fooled with a little ingenuity and $10 worth of household supplies.

Matsumoto uses gelatin, the stuff that Gummi Bears are made out of. First he takes a live finger and makes a plastic mold. (He uses a free-molding plastic used to make plastic molds, and is sold at hobby shops.) Then he pours liquid gelatin into the mold and lets it harden. (The gelatin comes in solid sheets, and is used to make jellied meats, soups, and candies, and is sold in grocery stores.) This gelatin fake finger fools fingerprint detectors about 80% of the time.

His more interesting experiment involves latent fingerprints. He takes a fingerprint left on a piece of glass, enhances it with a cyanoacrylate adhesive, and then photographs it with a digital camera. Using PhotoShop, he improves the contrast and prints the fingerprint onto a transparency sheet. Then, he takes a photo-sensitive printed-circuit board (PCB) and uses the fingerprint transparency to etch the fingerprint into the copper, making it three-dimensional. (You can find photo-sensitive PCBs, along with instructions for use, in most electronics hobby shops.) Finally, he makes a gelatin finger using the print on the PCB. This also fools fingerprint detectors about 80% of the time.

Gummy fingers can even fool sensors being watched by guards. Simply form the clear gelatin finger over your own. This lets you hide it as you press your own finger onto the sensor. After it lets you in, eat the evidence.

Matsumoto tried these attacks against eleven commercially available fingerprint biometric systems, and was able to reliably fool all of them. The results are enough to scrap the systems completely, and to send the various fingerprint biometric companies packing. Impressive is an understatement.

There's both a specific and a general moral to take away from this result. Matsumoto is not a professional fake-finger scientist; he's a mathematician. He didn't use expensive equipment or a specialized laboratory. He used $10 of ingredients you could buy, and whipped up his gummy fingers in the equivalent of a home kitchen. And he defeated eleven different commercial fingerprint readers, with both optical and capacitive sensors, and some with "live finger detection" features. (Moistening the gummy finger helps defeat sensors that measure moisture or electrical resistance; it takes some practice to get it right.) If he could do this, then any semi-professional can almost certainly do much much more.

More generally, be very careful before believing claims from security companies. All the fingerprint companies have claimed for years that this kind of thing is impossible. When they read Matsumoto's results, they're going to claim that they don't really work, or that they don't apply to them, or that they've fixed the problem. Think twice before believing them.

Matsumoto's paper is not on the Web. You can get a copy by asking:

Tsutomu Matsumoto <tsutomu@mlab.jks.ynu.ac.jp>

Here's the reference:

T. Matsumoto, H. Matsumoto, K. Yamada, S. Hoshino, "Impact of Artificial Gummy Fingers on Fingerprint Systems," Proceedings of SPIE Vol. #4677, Optical Security and Counterfeit Deterrence Techniques IV, 2002.
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