if shock "doesn't exist", (as many claim) - Page 6
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Old 06-29-2014, 10:41 PM   #51
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Delivering a non penetrating blow to nerves does nothing to explain hydrostatic shock.

Also, one can acclimate to constant pain.....even down there. Off and on will throw you for a loop, but constant and severe can be adjusted to.

I know. Surgical oops, with repair needed after...kidney and nuts stuff. 3 yrs of hell and then "pop" things got better pretty quickly.

100% recovery physically.

Mentally though it's made me a grouchy old bastard.



If anybody had kicked me in the balls then I'd have just smiled and then peeled all their skin off with a semi sharp knife.

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Old 06-29-2014, 10:54 PM   #52
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I shoot a .35 Rem in a 16.25" bbl, 200 grainers.
They migth be close to 2000 FPS at the muzzle..............so I expect no hydrostatic shock.
To help things last yr I tried to get the bullet to make a larger wound by clipping bone going in.
Result was a 2" or so wound through onside lung and liver, with no exit. Shot D under 50 yards.

Deer jolted and then ran hard for 30 yards or so and slammed into a big fallen tree, fell over.

Bullet came apart. Maybe out a ways it wouldn't have.

Deer tasted great (only have one roast left).

Kid should shoulder shoot some antlerless with it this yr. Let her get some data

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Old 06-29-2014, 10:54 PM   #53
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Here is another example that shock does exist! The example of an officer being shot with a bullet proof vest on!

For a vest to be certified against a specific bullet type and velocity, the following criteria must be met: the vest panel must prevent penetration from the impact of six bullets spaced at least two inches apart and three inches from the edge of the vest. In addition, the deflection caused by the backface deforming into a clay block must not exceed 44 millimeters, or 1.73 inches.1 During the early development phase, the researchers concluded that even though a bullet was stopped by the vest, the impact would at least leave a severe bruise and could theoretically kill by damaging underlying organs. This standard was designed to ensure a 95 percent probability of survival, with no more than a 10 percent probability of requiring surgery. The design development needed to find a balance between officer survival and a vest that was light enough and comfortable enough that it would actually be worn by line officers.2 Studies performed on animals shot while wearing Kevlar vests demonstrated fractured ribs and vertebrae; lacerations of the liver, spleen, and kidney; and contusions of the lungs and myocardium. 3 Although newer fibers have been developed with increased tensile strength and less weight, the original studies have not been repeated on these newer materials. These studies continue to be the basis for the recommendations for the medical care of officers shot wearing a vest in the NIJ guide titled Selection and Application Guide to Personal Body Armor.4

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Old 06-29-2014, 11:02 PM   #54
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You can get those types of wounds from wrecking a bicycle (handle bar pokes suck).

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Old 06-29-2014, 11:41 PM   #55
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BTW, poor guy served a warrant to a crazy nearby some yrs ago.
Crazy shot through the door with a .45-70 (or similar, dunno what bullet/weight).
Officer had a vest, but died.

Think the vest didn't fail, but there was enough backface deformation to not save the officer.

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Old 06-30-2014, 11:38 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainfire View Post
People who don't believe in the effects of hydro-static shock should pay close attention to the time lapse photos of a rifle bullet hitting ballistic gel, or a full gallon jug of water, then ask themselves what it feels like to get kicked in the kidneys or testicles. There is no penetration in the kick, and it won't kill you, but it can temporarily disable.
I did 'pay close attention' to it. It was found to have little to no effect in 'stopping the fight'. When you see the 'temporary stretch cavity' which you subscribe it is very dramatic, but it causes very little 'permanent' damage/wounding. The other thing very few people are aware of and fail to take into account is what some refer to as the 'numbing effect' caused by the impact of any object which caused serious damage to tissue. This I have witnessed first hand many times. What you refer to a 'hydrostatic shock' actually deadens the neurons and causes them to not 'feel' the pain for several minutes after impact. This is one of the bodies 'survival' reactions to sever trauma. Most the people I have first hand knowledge of and have interviewed stated all they felt from the bullets impact was a 'sting' similar to a wasp or bee, then in the next 10 to 15 minutes the pain will set in.
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Old 06-30-2014, 11:52 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hookeye View Post
BTW, poor guy served a warrant to a crazy nearby some yrs ago.
Crazy shot through the door with a .45-70 (or similar, dunno what bullet/weight).
Officer had a vest, but died.

Think the vest didn't fail, but there was enough backface deformation to not save the officer.
True. The newer vests are made to spread the impact over a much larger area.
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Old 07-01-2014, 03:27 AM   #58
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Just for fun go get a beer all and chill while watching the slow motion videos of bullets entering and expanding ballistic gel at BrassFetcher.com

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Old 07-01-2014, 07:14 AM   #59
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Ballistic gel.............was it designed to be a decent test medium or an ideal replication of flesh?

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Old 07-01-2014, 07:29 AM   #60
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Ballistic gel.............was it designed to be a decent test medium or an ideal replication of flesh?
IIRC, it has a similiar property as flesh, but not exact and is used more since the results are using an identical test medium for comparisons.
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