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Old 02-10-2013, 09:37 PM   #31
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Ballistic numbers are interesting to debate, but I do not use them as a means to determine what caliber I carry. My standard is much simpler. What's the biggest caliber that I know I will carry every day. For me, that's a 9mm.
Agreed, for winter/fall, but summer is much smaller, 25.
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Old 02-11-2013, 02:39 PM   #32
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Agreed, for winter/fall, but summer is much smaller, 25.
Mrs. Martha Faulk, former proprietoress of East Park Sporting Hardware, used to use this illustration: "If someone's coming at you and you have a choice of a little stick or a big stick, which would you choose to defend yourself with?"

I prefer the big stick. Regardless of the time of year, throw as much lead as possible.

I go with a .44.

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Old 02-11-2013, 02:42 PM   #33
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Mrs. Martha Faulk, former proprietoress of East Park Sporting Hardware, used to use this illustration: "If someone's coming at you and you have a choice of a little stick or a big stick, which would you choose to defend yourself with?"

I prefer the big stick. Regardless of the time of year, throw as much lead as possible.

I go with a .44.

Bob Wright

Try concealing that in gym shorts and tee shirt.
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Old 02-11-2013, 02:59 PM   #34
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Rule #1. Chose a PPD that you WILL carry!
A 'little' gun in the hand is better than a 'big' gun in the car or at home!!!

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Old 02-11-2013, 07:07 PM   #35
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Mrs. Martha Faulk, former proprietoress of East Park Sporting Hardware, used to use this illustration: "If someone's coming at you and you have a choice of a little stick or a big stick, which would you choose to defend yourself with?"

I prefer the big stick. Regardless of the time of year, throw as much lead as possible.

I go with a .44.

Bob Wright
Don't disagree, but my summer clothing doesn't allow for anything larger and I won't change my comfort to allow for the larger gun. So I'd rather have my 25 around because tis better to have a 25 in your pocket than a 9mm at home...
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:25 PM   #36
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Interesting statement Jon.
The magic number seems to be around 1300-1400 fps. This is where bullets go from needing a large permanent wound channel to wreak havoc to the non permanent hydrostatic channel able to impart enough shock effect to do permanent damage to vital structures.

I liken it to using a field point arrow vs an arrow with a four bladed razor tip when hunting. They will both wound and incapacitate and kill one just does it far better and faster.

But the point of self defense isnt to kill its to make the goblin cease action. So center mass hits with something like a pocket 380 that makes the goblin stop is just as effective as anything else. Most of the time just the sound of gunshots heading in the goblin's direction is enough to make them flee.

I just dont get wrapped up anymore in the debate over whats the best round. Ive boiled self defense carry to these basic rules in order of importance:

1: have a gun with you at all times
2: have a gun that is 100% reliable as possible
3: know your use of force laws
4: practice with your gun at a shooting range at realistic self defense distance (7 yards or less)
5: have a cellphone capable of dialing 911 even if its a cheap prepaid or one with no paid service but still able to dial 911 be sure it is capable of allowing tracking by 911 if you cant talk.

Simple rules that will save your life if its possible to be saved in a given situation.
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Old 02-12-2013, 10:10 PM   #37
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The magic number seems to be around 1300-1400 fps. This is where bullets go from needing a large permanent wound channel to wreak havoc to the non permanent hydrostatic channel able to impart enough shock effect to do permanent damage to vital structures.

I liken it to using a field point arrow vs an arrow with a four bladed razor tip when hunting. They will both wound and incapacitate and kill one just does it far better and faster.

But the point of self defense isnt to kill its to make the goblin cease action. So center mass hits with something like a pocket 380 that makes the goblin stop is just as effective as anything else. Most of the time just the sound of gunshots heading in the goblin's direction is enough to make them flee.

I just dont get wrapped up anymore in the debate over whats the best round. Ive boiled self defense carry to these basic rules in order of importance:

1: have a gun with you at all times
2: have a gun that is 100% reliable as possible
3: know your use of force laws
4: practice with your gun at a shooting range at realistic self defense distance (7 yards or less)
5: have a cellphone capable of dialing 911 even if its a cheap prepaid or one with no paid service but still able to dial 911 be sure it is capable of allowing tracking by 911 if you cant talk.

Simple rules that will save your life if its possible to be saved in a given situation.
1A. That you shot well!
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Old 02-12-2013, 10:24 PM   #38
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Right on Jim.

And remember, a man actually hit with a .22 LR is damaged a helluva lot more than a man missed with a ,44 Mag,

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Old 02-13-2013, 10:56 PM   #39
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And remember, a man actually hit with a .22 LR is damaged a helluva lot more than a man missed with a ,44 Mag,
What gets overlooked in this view of the world is that a man actually hit with a .44 Magnum (or .44 Special, .357 Magnum, .45 ACP, .40 S&W, or even .38 Special) is damaged a lot more than a man actually hit with a .22 long rifle. I do not understand the frame of mind believing one cannot shoot a larger caliber as well as a smaller caliber. Not to mention a four inch N frame revolver is easier to handle and shoot accurately than a Beretta Jetfire or Minx.

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...I won't change my comfort to allow for the larger gun.
If that's your choice, okay. I will not surrender my security - and the security of people I love - for a minor amount of comfort. That's my choice.

Do I base my defensive ammo choice on "ballistics numbers"? I suppose I do, but it depends on what one allows as 'ballistics numbers'. I don't put much stock in kinetic energy, as that depends too much on velocity (Kinetic energy = mass of bullet times velocity squared). A round with impressive muzzle energy (high speed light bullet) will lose a good deal of the velocity quickly and that means the kinetic energy is quickly lost.

I prefer bullet momentum (mass time velocity) as an indicator. Typically, this indicates a heavier bullet at a somewhat lower velocity than the 'fast & light' theory.

And, I do pay attention to bullet shape as well. A bullet with a large, flat meplat seems to deliver more of the impact into the target rather than figuratively slipping through the target. Expanding bullets are fine, but consider; the function of a hollow point expanding bullet is to become a large, flat fronted bullet. So I prefer revolver bullets to be full wadcutter profile - but not loaded flush with the case mouth.

Auto-pistols require a bit more 'taper' than revolver in the feed end of the cartridge. Most will feed semi-wadcutter bullets with regularity; and hollow points which function are a delight.
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Old 02-14-2013, 04:09 AM   #40
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What gets overlooked in this view of the world is that a man actually hit with a .44 Magnum (or .44 Special, .357 Magnum, .45 ACP, .40 S&W, or even .38 Special) is damaged a lot more than a man actually hit with a .22 long rifle. I do not understand the frame of mind believing one cannot shoot a larger caliber as well as a smaller caliber. Not to mention a four inch N frame revolver is easier to handle and shoot accurately than a Beretta Jetfire or Minx.
I don't disagree that a larger caliber is far better, That's a no brainer.

But where are you going to carry your N frame when you're wearing shorts or sweats??? Are you going to put on a jacket and an N frame when you're just running to the market for milk??

There are other considerations than caliber when choosing whether or not to carry, and what to carry. The big N frame in your sock drawer, or glove box doesn't help when you're away fron house and vehicle.

And the old time "momentum" theory was debunked decades ago. That died out with Jeffie Cooper.
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