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Old 12-07-2011, 09:13 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Alpha1Victor View Post
The recall has be finalized. To be honest with you... Scrap the laser idea. The laser on the p238 is a switch on/off and is difficult to do with one hand. If the situation arises, the last thing your going to be thinking is I need to turn on my laser. You will want to be sending rounds down range. Also using a laser on your gun is frowned upon in a court of law. They will see you either as not being proficient with your gun(bad) or use of excessive force(bad). I have seen this happen in court. If the perp is close enough you can just point and shoot without using sights.

Just my .02

Signing out, Alpha1victor.
I didn't consider that. I just was looking at the potential upside.

I may have to scrap that idea. I know the public would interpret it differently (as you said) but just for the record the reason i liked it is because if i did have enough time to turn the laser on it would just make me just that much more safe and confident i could land the first shot (in the event they have a gun of their own) but you're right.

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Go out and get a well used S&W airweight J frame revolver in 38sp. Good CC handgun .They hold up well and can bought cheap and conceal very easy then as you find your self at the range start asking questions and most shooter will let someone try what they have, You will with some time find a another you just have to have.

Revolvers seem great as they rarely jam unless the gun has a serious malfunction but I dislike the fact that i only get 5-8 shots and its hard to reload if need be.

At least w/ pistols i can eject the mag and put in a freshly loaded clip in within a few short seconds.

Idk. i have a lot of hard decisions to make.


Also...the Sig Sauer i was falling in love with (p238) apparently isn't an option in my state: California. I failed to realize that it said on their site that its restricted in CA.

idk how or why as the mag holds less than 10 shots (i heard ca legal guns must have 10 or less magazine capacity to be CA legal. im not sure what other restrictions there are. well except for fully autos.

so back to square one.
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Old 12-10-2011, 11:21 PM   #12
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The j-frame s&w .38, s&w bodyguard .380, ruger LCP... A small concealable " mouse " gun is all you need. 5-6 rounds are more than enough. More than likely, when it is absolutely necessary to pull the trigger, you will only be 3-5 yards away, the .38 and the .380 have plenty of stopping power at that distance.
The odds of you ever being in a Hollywood style shoot-out are astronomical.
If you empty a 12 round clip at someone that's more than 7 yards away, you will probably have some "major"legal issues.

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Old 12-10-2011, 11:34 PM   #13
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just for the record the reason i liked it is because if i did have enough time to turn the laser on it would just make me just that much more safe and confident i could land the first shot (in the event they have a gun of their own)
i do a lot of shooting at public ranges. ive seen a LOT of lasers in use but ive never seen any evidence that lasers improve aim. some of the absolute worst shooting ive witnessed has been by people with lasers.

my opinion is that starting out and pretending lasers bypass the fundamentals of marksmanship is a key way to ensure the bad guy shoots you dead.

my advice whatever firearm you choose laser or not leave the laser off when you practice. concentrate on proper stance, grip, sight picture, and trigger control. the laser wil not bypass that.

a laser in the hands of a skilled marksman well schooled in the fundamentals is a superb tool for self defense. a laser in the hands of a person with the false belief it makes them a better shot is a fast track to the county morgue.
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Old 12-10-2011, 11:44 PM   #14
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you cant use a laser to hunt with in Wis. thats per the DNR nazi"s.

most all self defense gun battles takes place around 10 feet or less so why would a person need a laser? iron sights is what you need close up.

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Old 12-10-2011, 11:55 PM   #15
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All this talk about lasers, I checked out a laser bedecked kel tec 9mm at a local pawn shop a couple days ago. I looked at the laser dot and the sights while I aimed it at the store safe's door (of course the weapon was clear y'all) and POA for sights and laser dot were about 6 inches away from each other, at about 10 feet. Most are adjustable I think, but I too recommend practice, practice, practice. Make it become second nature, sight picture/sight alignment. If you ever get to the point where you can pick up your carry gun, close your eyes, present your weapon in a firing position, open your eyes and the sight picture/alignment are perfect, you know your doing something right.

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Old 12-11-2011, 12:41 AM   #16
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Consider a Kel-tec P-11 9mm, 10 + 1 concealable and dependable, good little pistols....

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Old 12-11-2011, 01:21 PM   #17
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1. Kahr CW9
2. Ruger LC9
3. Kel-Tec PF9

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Old 12-11-2011, 01:42 PM   #18
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The 238 is an excellent little mouse gun. If you want something lighter, check out the LCP.
The LCP is just as reliable, lighter, but has no real sights.
I own a Colt Mustang, which is the gun that the 238 essentially copied. (They are like twins) Great little gun, but very heavy for a little gun. As a result, I never carry the all metal gun, in favor of the LCP(I pocket carry the mouse guns, as I only carry a mouse gun in the heat of summer, with very few clothes on)

As far as a laser is concerned, practice can't be beat. Tiny guns like these are not intended to be shot at distance. They are really intended for 5 to 15 ft. Point shooting is really what a user will be doing.
I do have a laser on my lcp, but it is mostly on there to use as a deterent. That little red dot can be a real eye opener.

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Old 12-11-2011, 03:54 PM   #19
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Of all the small 380's, the Sig 238 has the crispest, lightest trigger by far. I'm hesitant to call it best, but it is in my opinion. That's the big reason I ruled it out immediately. When you draw that gun, you are guaranteed to be in a high stress situation with enough adrenalin running through your veins to make an 8 pound trigger feel like 8 ounces. The last thing I want in that situation is an accidental discharge.

I also carry in pocket, and I'm not comfortable carrying a short, single action trigger in my pocket. In a holster I think it would be fine.

I recommend you try out several pocket guns and other CC options.

For myself, I carry a Smith & Wesson Bodyguard 380. Small form factor, real sights on it that can be changed (I have a set of XS Big Dot sights on mine) long DAO trigger, easy to break down, safety (kind of superfluous with the DAO trigger), last shot hold open, and laser (great for training).

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Old 01-06-2012, 07:53 PM   #20
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Can't go wrong with a Sig !

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