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Old 05-23-2009, 10:51 PM   #21
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Ok, who thinks Acid is taking this way too seriously?
I think Acid is taking this in the spirit it was asked. Well done for you, sir.

I think we have omitted the ejection port. If my weapon ejects up and right, does the escaping gas push me down and left?

Does the tumbling brass tumble for eternity?

When does J.D. get back?
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Old 05-24-2009, 12:10 PM   #22
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Ok, who thinks Acid is taking this way too seriously?
Me??? Serious??? I'm just one of those geeks you saw in high school with a slide rule on his belt (no...didn't have a pocket protector). For those of you younglings, slide rules were the pre-electronic calculators. When I was in high school (1965 - 1968) those $2 calculators you see today in the blister packs, that only add, subtract, multiply and divide, cost well over $200 back then. And they were the TOP of the line, did everything but wipe your butt calculators, then.

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I think Acid is taking this in the spirit it was asked. Well done for you, sir.

I think we have omitted the ejection port. If my weapon ejects up and right, does the escaping gas push me down and left?

Does the tumbling brass tumble for eternity?

When does J.D. get back?
The small amount of gas at the receiver, and the very minimal mass of the casing going up and right would have a lot less effect (read a fart in a hurricane) than the major ejection of gas at the muzzle. Depending on your mass however, there is a slight chance of a minor yaw or roll from the ejected casing but it could take months for it to manifest itself in your conscious view.

The tumbling brass would go on for as long as no other stellar body affected it. Gravity throughout the Universe is pervasive (that's my 50¢ word for today) so depending on the galactic direction the brass took, for all intents and purposes it would go on for a long time. With such little mass, though, interstellar dust will affect its overall speed so "eternity" wouldn't be the fate of that tumbling brass.

As for the whereabouts of J.D.? Hell if I know. I'm a science geek who owns a bunch of guns.
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Old 05-24-2009, 03:41 PM   #23
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Slide rules are for techies. Try wearing an abacus on your belt, young man.

Would the round, catching the rifling, cause torque, thereby spinning you counter to the rifling?

If it was that dirty Wolf ammo, with the steel case, would the spent case erode?

How far would the round travel before there was a reduction in stopping power?

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Old 05-25-2009, 01:42 PM   #24
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Slide rules are for techies. Try wearing an abacus on your belt, young man.

Would the round, catching the rifling, cause torque, thereby spinning you counter to the rifling?

If it was that dirty Wolf ammo, with the steel case, would the spent case erode?

How far would the round travel before there was a reduction in stopping power?
I just missed the "abacus" era in high school so I guess I'll defer to the wisdom of the ages.

As for spin induced by rifling, we're back to the mass of the bullet versus the mass of the shooter. Even with a 230 gr slug that still doesn't come close to the mass of the human body, and adding the mass of the life support equipment, it's even farther from close. There is some twist to the weapon when fired so that's a possible reaction to induce spin in the shooter though.

Wolf, or any other ammo for that matter, would have no special attributes in space in regards to corrosion/erosion. Interstellar dust, micro-metorites and other space debris causes problems with anything floating around. So it would erode. As for how long it would take, it would depend on the amount of interstellar dust it encounters on its passage through our solar system.

Stopping power on Earth is measured in yards. Stopping power in space can probably be measured in hundreds or thousands of miles. That's back to Newton's First Law, "...an object in uniform motion tends to stay in uniform motion unless acted upon by a net external force." With little gravity and no atmospheric drag, the round could travel extremely long distances with no reduction in velocity or "stopping power."
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Old 05-25-2009, 03:16 PM   #25
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Stopping power on Earth is measured in yards. Stopping power in space can probably be measured in hundreds or thousands of miles. That's back to Newton's First Law, "...an object in uniform motion tends to stay in uniform motion unless acted upon by a net external force." With little gravity and no atmospheric drag, the round could travel extremely long distances with no reduction in velocity or "stopping power."

But solar winds and dust would slow down the bullet.
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Old 05-25-2009, 03:55 PM   #26
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But solar winds and dust would slow down the bullet.
True. There would be some interference from these effects but the overall distance, or range of stopping power, would still be in the hundreds or thousands of miles. When you consider part of Newton's equation, "unless acted upon by a net external force," solar winds and dust would qualify as net external forces. The distance for measured stopping power of the bullet would still be quite great.
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Old 05-25-2009, 06:11 PM   #27
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Now, if we are talking about firing into a spacial vacuum, the bullet, any bullet would continue around the universe unimpeded back to the place of origin (in theory) You mentioned gravity in a higher grain bullet, but gravity in a vacuum is still zero... and even in a gravitational environment, a golf ball and watermelon dropped at the same height will hit the ground at the same time.

Denis Miller, eh? Do I drip arrogance and inside humor that no one else understands? Maybe the arrogance...

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Old 05-25-2009, 09:56 PM   #28
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Newton's Third Law states that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. I would postulate (there's my 50¢ word usage for the day) that if you fired a weapon in space, assuming you're not braced against anything or tethered to anything, you'd be propelled backwards with the same force that propelled the bullet forward.

Newton's First Law states that an object at rest tends to stay at rest and that an object in uniform motion tends to stay in uniform motion unless acted upon by a net external force. So inertia would be nearly nonexistent in the vacuum of space because the only thing to act on the movement of the bullet would be the gravitational forces of the solar system in particular and the galaxy in total. Atmospheric drag wouldn't come into play in space. (In space, no one can hear you fart, let alone scream)

The gravitational "pull" of an object depends upon its mass (not weight). Therefore, I'd think (already used postulate today) that the 230 gr would have a larger, albeit by a very small margin, gravitational pull than the 185 gr.
In space would the firing pin even be able to move fast enough to set off the bullet? How long would it take the bullet to exit the chamber? With there being air inside the bullet and with the explosion having no air once released; Would the bullet just explode inside the gun? Or would the gun implode?

I may not be the smartest in the forum but at least I know not to bring a gun into space.....you bring a lightsaber lol
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Old 05-25-2009, 10:15 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by AcidFlashGordon View Post
Newton's Third Law states that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. I would postulate (there's my 50¢ word usage for the day) that if you fired a weapon in space, assuming you're not braced against anything or tethered to anything, you'd be propelled backwards with the same force that propelled the bullet forward.

(In space, no one can hear you fart, let alone scream)
Interesting! I recall one of those team-building exercises from business school in which we had to rank the importance of various objects to survival in SHTF situations such as "jeep breaks down in snow storm" "you lose canoe in wilderness float" "your lunar rover runs outta juice" etc. One of the items on the "lunar rover" exercise was a .45 revolver (no, i didn't ask for more of a description); i ranked it fairly highly for reasons of ultimate personal problem resolution (not into asphyxiation). Strangely enough, the revolver was the most important item in the exercise, for propulsion as you jumped around the moon. I'm still not sure i believe that wasn't a setup.

(Could they hear me gagging from the smell in my suit?)
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Old 05-25-2009, 10:26 PM   #30
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In space would the firing pin even be able to move fast enough to set off the bullet? How long would it take the bullet to exit the chamber? With there being air inside the bullet and with the explosion having no air once released; Would the bullet just explode inside the gun? Or would the gun implode?
I wouldn't worry about the firing pin speed one bit. Modern bullet design should still create thrust in a proper direction for it to properly exit the barrel, and only real change to how quickly it exited the barrel should be due to lack of atmophere within the barrel itself; the initial speed and velocity of the projectile should remain about the same.

What is everyone's thought on exposure to the extremely low temperature in space on your ammunition? Since cold makes metal contract, and the rate of contraction is different for metals of different densities, it could cause some problem.

Maybe I'll try google...
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