POSSESSION OF HIGH CAP MAGS NOT ILLEGAL IN CA!!! referrence included - Page 2
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Old 02-20-2010, 10:44 PM   #11
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(2) Commencing January 1, 2000, manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity magazine.
I take it this is the line that is relevant to this discussion? Sounds like the only person breaking the law would be the person who gave or sold it, not the buyer or receiver as TheDaggle states. However I would be very careful about use of a hi-cap magazine in Cali. I think you could get on the wrong side of the law easily and the hi-cap magazine would draw attention.

Here is an example.

I go to the range with my friend. I pull out a gun with hi-cap magazine, I have owned this gun and magazine since before 2000. I am shooting and everything is fine. My friend says, hey can I try that out looks like a nice gun. I let him take a single shot with it.

I have just broken the law by "lending" to a friend.

Just be careful is all I'm saying, loopholes are great but is the risk of accidentally breaking the law worth the reward of a hi-cap magazine. Now if you only kept it in your SHTF box or something, then I can see that. If it were me, I probably wouldn't risk it, I prefer to have a larger buffer between what I do and breaking a law.

/I'm no lawyer, I only play one on the internet. Taking legal advice from me is just plain stupid, talk to a real lawyer, or at least someone who plays one on TV.
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Old 02-20-2010, 11:29 PM   #12
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What I want to know is how can you obtain a high cap mag in CA legally or as theDaggle states "other than expressly prohibited."

I don't care, I'm retired LE and have a high cap permit. But if someone else wants not only to risk getting arrested but to lose their right to posses a gun for the rest of their life, hey man enjoy the ride.

As far as grandfathered mags. If you get caught with a hi cap, their is no way to tell how long you have had the mag, but he will find out how long you've had the gun. If he finds that you bought the gun in lets say 2004, guess what...you're done and he won't give a crap about how you obtained them.

EDIT: What I mean is, the officer and the DA will only be able to assume since you cannot prove when or how you got it (because you probably won't rat out the person who gave it to you) then you HAD to have imported it. NOW you're in the sh!t. But you are right, posses them all you want, but if you get asked how you got them and you can't prove their preban, then they will assume you bought them out of state and imported them. Know what I mean Vern?

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Old 02-20-2010, 11:39 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by TheDaggle View Post
A lot of people seem to be missing my point. Of course, mags owned pre-ban are exempt, but my point is that possession of any kind is not prohibited. The law does not state that possession before the ban is exempt, it is exempt by way of omission, as are any other form of possession that did not originate from manufacture or import. Even if you did not own them before the ban, if you acquired them through means other than those expressly prohibited, you should be covered under the same principle of omission. If, for instance, you are an LEO and you retire or quit, you acquired them legally after the ban, and possession is not prohibited, so though you are no longer an LEO, there is no law against you keeping your hi-cap mags. Yes, violating the ban IS a serious felony, but the law DOES NOT prohibit possession or receipt of any kind! Only manufacture, import, and distribution. If you acquire them through a means not expressly prohibited, and you do not attempt to sell them or give them away, there shouldn't be any problem.
Do yourself a favor before you get too excited and call DOJ firearms division at (916) 263-4887. Yes you can posses them, if you can legally posses a hi cap mag. How do you do that? Get a high cap permit, a badge or have owned one before 2000. I am not saying you can't get them, but getting them is pretty difficult with out "importing" it into CA. Only way to get one is to import it (then you are in trouble), buy it (then the dealer is in trouble) or get one given to you (then they're in trouble). You probably won't get into that much trouble, but how are you going to find someone who is willing to risk their freedom so you can own one?


EDIT: One more thing. It probably won't go here unless you really screw up, but it can. Do you know when you import by crossing state lines for the purpose of committing a crime like buying magazines in Nevada and bringing them into California, that someone else gets involved? Do you know who? I'll give you a hint they work for the federal government and are responsible for interstate commerce.
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From the great speaker...er uh Barak Obongo

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Old 02-21-2010, 02:38 AM   #14
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Are we really still discussing this? The mags are legal to own, possess and use.

And if you bought the mags before buying the firearm they go to, they are still fine. I own plenty of mags for guns that I have never owned. Why? Because someday I will probably end up with another of those guns.

I bought my first M14 mag (an HR-R) when I was 10 years old. Bought it at The Post Exchange in Northridge, CA. for $.50 (fifty cents). Bought my first M14 when I was 19. I still have the mag, but that M14 is long gone.

Read the law carefully, it will explain the magazine aspect clearly if you break it down into bite sized pieces.

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Old 02-21-2010, 02:52 AM   #15
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Question

As I understand it there is no registration on rifles. How will any LEO know what I owned and when.

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Old 02-21-2010, 02:59 AM   #16
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As I understand it there is no registration on rifles. How will any LEO know what I owned and when.
You are correct. I was referring to HG's.

M14, we are not talking about possession. It looks like he is inferring that you can get the magazines somewhere else where it is legal and bring them here. THAT IS NOT POSSESSION, that is importation. He is also saying if he were to get them in an estate sale of some kind he would be okay. That is not legal either, the person who possess them might not bare the brunt of that one, but the seller/giver would.
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Thomas Jefferson
From the great speaker...er uh Barak Obongo

"Liberals make great proctologists. They're the only ones who truly know what the inside of an anus looks like."~me

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Old 02-21-2010, 03:09 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by DarinCraft View Post
You are correct. I was referring to HG's.

M14, we are not talking about possession. It looks like he is inferring that you can get the magazines somewhere else where it is legal and bring them here. THAT IS NOT POSSESSION, that is importation. He is also saying if he were to get them in an estate sale of some kind he would be okay. That is not legal either, the person who possess them might not bare the brunt of that one, but the seller/giver would.
Dig it. You are correct about the part of his post regarding inheriting. There is no provision that I have seen in the law for that. The law does not allow for "Transfer of ownership" of the mags.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:03 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Yunus View Post
I take it this is the line that is relevant to this discussion? Sounds like the only person breaking the law would be the person who gave or sold it, not the buyer or receiver as TheDaggle states. However I would be very careful about use of a hi-cap magazine in Cali. I think you could get on the wrong side of the law easily and the hi-cap magazine would draw attention.

Here is an example.

I go to the range with my friend. I pull out a gun with hi-cap magazine, I have owned this gun and magazine since before 2000. I am shooting and everything is fine. My friend says, hey can I try that out looks like a nice gun. I let him take a single shot with it.

I have just broken the law by "lending" to a friend.

Just be careful is all I'm saying, loopholes are great but is the risk of accidentally breaking the law worth the reward of a hi-cap magazine. Now if you only kept it in your SHTF box or something, then I can see that. If it were me, I probably wouldn't risk it, I prefer to have a larger buffer between what I do and breaking a law.

/I'm no lawyer, I only play one on the internet. Taking legal advice from me is just plain stupid, talk to a real lawyer, or at least someone who plays one on TV.
With that specific scenario in mind, the law states further down that there is an exemption for legal owners of high cap mags loaning them to a non-firearm-prohibited individual as long as the legal owner is in a proximity to the user as such that he could access them in time to claim them in the event they were called in to question, but thank you for being the first to understand what I was actually saying.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:06 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by TheDaggle View Post
With that specific scenario in mind, the law states further down that there is an exemption for legal owners of high cap mags loaning them to a non-firearm-prohibited individual as long as the legal owner is in a proximity to the user as such that he could access them in time to claim them in the event they were called in to question, but thank you for being the first to understand what I was actually saying.
What is there to understand. You are promoting "obtaining" hi cap mags that you did not own prior to the ban and are clearly stating you have found a "loophole." What about that is being misunderstood? You never once mentioned using a friends hi caps. You stated if you could get them somehow then you were ok to posses them, which is not true unless you legal obtain them through the three ways I listed earlier.
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Thomas Jefferson
From the great speaker...er uh Barak Obongo

"Liberals make great proctologists. They're the only ones who truly know what the inside of an anus looks like."~me
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:08 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by DarinCraft View Post
You are correct. I was referring to HG's.

M14, we are not talking about possession. It looks like he is inferring that you can get the magazines somewhere else where it is legal and bring them here. THAT IS NOT POSSESSION, that is importation. He is also saying if he were to get them in an estate sale of some kind he would be okay. That is not legal either, the person who possess them might not bare the brunt of that one, but the seller/giver would.
I specifically said I was NOT talking about importation, only possession. I am well aware that importation is prohibited, but POSSESSION is NOT listed in the prohibited conditions. If you were on a dump run, and saw a 30rd mag on a pile of trash, you could pick it up and keep it, and I can't see any way you would be violating any law. You didn't import or manufacture or furnish it. Furthermore, in an estate SALE, the seller would be liable, obviously. If it were part of an estate BEQUEATHED to you, you have not imported, manufactured, or furnished it, and the furnisher is the estate of a person who by definition is beyond the laws of this land....
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